Hip Hop & Pow Wows Collide?

dancingfancy · 01-18-2007, 01:11 PM

Check out this article: -Hip Hop & Pow Wows Collide -

Santa Fe – Early this year a video of two unidentified young females dancing at an outdoor pow-wow in their regalia, hip-hop style, was circulated among Native Americans all over the nation. Since then, their dancing has been the center of controversy among pow-wow goers.

In the video, the astonished audience in the background watch the two girls shake their bottoms to the ground as if they were in a nightclub. Moreover, one young woman dancing in her jingle dress performs a split like a teenage cheerleader and bounces on the ground.

The CHRONICLE gathered reaction to the dancing from across Indian country.

“Native American dances in general do not have outwardly sexual or dance movements that mimic sexual intimacy,” said Tamara Francis, cultural preservation specialist of the Caddo, Delaware, Pawnee, and Muskogee tribes.

Chuck Butzin, visitor service representative of the Ziibiwing Center of Anishinabe Culture and Lifeways, who is part Ojibway and part-German from Mt. Pleasant, Mich., said, “The girl shouldn’t be in that dress while dancing in that manner. The dress was given to us (Ojibway) for healing purposes, not to shake your booty in it. The dress has a story behind it that she should respect.”............
(((The rest of the article/pictures and video footage can be read and viewed here at this link: http://www.iaiachronicle.org/archives/HipHopPowWows.htm )))

bushy_braids · 01-18-2007, 05:46 PM

just for clarification...

people draw conclusions way too quickly and take things out of porportion

i know exactly what video you're talkin' bout and along w/the e-mail was something like "how ndns on the east coast powwow" and that was wrong...

the story behind it is this:
the group that hosts certain powwows in ny and nj have dance competitions during their breaks. they play rap music and have the ndns dance like they're in the club and then they play powwow music and have the spectators dance like ndns. that's where the booty shakin' video and dance came from.
everyone gets out there and shakes a tail feather and laughs at each other and who ever gets the most cheers, of course wins.

i'm not saying it's right for the girl to go out there and shake her booty and do the splits and this and that... but that's what she chose to do in her outfit in the powwow circle during a special dance that was held probably during a break.

what can ya do?

i've also seen many edgy videos of switch dancers doing the same thing, but not as many people were outraged... what's the difference if its all in fun? i guess it's how the people choose to act up in attempts to win...

**kneegrow_native** · 01-29-2007, 07:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bushy_braids

i've also seen many edgy videos of switch dancers doing the same thing, but not as many people were outraged... what's the difference if its all in fun? i guess it's how the people choose to act up in attempts to win...

This is a really good point. I have seen many guys dress up in jingle dresses and get crazy dumb and people think it is real funny...and this was out west!

lclbcook · 01-29-2007, 09:46 PM

yeah what can u do. todays younger generation just makes a mockery out of our culture, and people see that and think its cute. its sad.

kgirl7 · 01-30-2007, 06:13 PM

I didn't like the dance in the jingle dress but I thought the fancy dress was fine. I've seen male switch dancers put on a jingle dress and dance and behave 10 times worse.

tsuj510 · 02-01-2007, 02:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kgirl7

I didn't like the dance in the jingle dress but I thought the fancy dress was fine. I've seen male switch dancers put on a jingle dress and dance and behave 10 times worse.

Yeah, but thats different-both those dances are sacred, but for different reasons. I guess you gotta look for the good and bad in a thing like that, you know? Yeah, they might be acting up a bit, in sacred clothes, but we have always had sacred clowns and wintkes and they are sacred too. such-contridictions if you will-the profane and the sacred side-by-side... Just a bit of each in both, innit?

It all works out; as long as its done in fun and not mocking others who may be different from ourselves. If I hear another Brokeback joke during a Switch dance....

that's annoying...

kgirl7 · 02-01-2007, 02:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tsuj510

Yeah, but thats different-both those dances are sacred, but for different reasons. I guess you gotta look for the good and bad in a thing like that, you know? Yeah, they might be acting up a bit, in sacred clothes, but we have always had sacred clowns and wintkes and they are sacred too. such-contridictions if you will-the profane and the sacred side-by-side... Just a bit of each in both, innit?

It all works out; as long as its done in fun and not mocking others who may be different from ourselves. If I hear another Brokeback joke during a Switch dance....

that's annoying...

"We" meaning which tribe? From what I understand the jingle dress has very specific and sacred origins from the Ojibwe people different from the fancy shawl dress. Plus the girl in the fancy shawl dress isn't gyrating or booty-poopin. She's doing a the "perculator" and then the "heel toe" lol. I'm not going to pretend that I even know half of what the jingle dress means to the Ojibwe people, but do I know enough to know it wasn't given for booty shaking and for men to dress up in it and act all sexy-like.

n8iveFancii43 · 03-05-2007, 08:37 PM

ok, well i have to STRONGLY disagree with you on that one. i for one and as well as many of my friends on the trail do NOT make a mockery out of the culture. we simply like to have fun. that is not a crime and it does not mean that we do not respect our culture. we are simply trying to have fun while learning our culture. and when it comes to those specials, those are not decided by the youth they are decided by the arena directors and so therefore its not the youth making a mockery its the ADULTS that are making the decision to have some fun as well.

so all i can say is that im sorry that you feel that way. but its not how it is AT ALL.

nativeproud · 03-11-2007, 01:46 AM

now im gonna have to strongly disagree with you. what these girls are doing is wrong, now i also dont know much about jingle or fancy shaw dancing, but i do know they are very sacred things. if they wanna go out and dance like that, thats fine, just dont do it in dance cloths, they are sacred things and should be used for the sacred dances they are intended for. if they want to dance like that, they should do it in their street clothes, i dont think anyone would have any problem with that.

**OneidaDreamer** · 04-20-2007, 02:11 AM

I"m gonna have to go ahead and disagree with the whole article's use of the term 'HIP-HOP'. I'm 99.99% sure that they weren't shakin their tail feathers to Real Hip-Hop Music out there.

It was RAP Music. A b@$t@rd-step-child of Hip-Hop Music. For those of you who don't know the difference or may think you do; you'd better stop by my post entitled Hip-Hop Culture Amongst Turtle Islanders.

And if you disagree with me about the intricacies of Rap and Hip-Hop then you obviously don't know what your talking about.

As far as those people doing all that booty dancing out there in the circle. No comment...

Peace O.D.

Southern Comfort · 04-20-2007, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lclbcook

yeah what can u do. todays younger generation just makes a mockery out of our culture, and people see that and think its cute. its sad.

lol i don't mean to sound rude but i am part of the younger genaration i don't know of ne kids my age that micks out culture i mean yes some of us may party and do crazy things like that but when it comes down to respecting out culture thats when the tables turn...
me being a young native women i was very disgusted by the way these girls were acting .. i am a jingle dress dancer and one of the things that i learned going through cerimonies and things to become 1 was to respect yourself, your dress, your family and YOUR CULTURE.... the jingle dress dancer was a little bit out of line and as for the men who dance in jingle dresses for a switch dance yes some of them do get a little out of hand but they didn't have to go through the things that us ladies have to do to be able to wear the dress...

but that is all i really have to say....

Kaina1128 · 05-12-2008, 08:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OneidaDreamer

I"m gonna have to go ahead and disagree with the whole article's use of the term 'HIP-HOP'. I'm 99.99% sure that they weren't shakin their tail feathers to Real Hip-Hop Music out there.

It was RAP Music.
Peace O.D.

actually, it was a remix of a smoke dance song

if I were holding this type of contest i would make sure that no jingle dresses or eagle feathers were worn. i think it's a cool song and a fun idea, but it's always good to take every precaution with sacred items.

i thought this forum was going to be about poems and songs and other creative writing...

01-18-2007, 01:11 PM	#1 (permalink)
dancingfancy Void Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: from Sudbury, Ontario, sometimes Calgary and Michigan...take your pick! LOL Posts: 3	Hip Hop & Pow Wows Collide? Check out this article: -Hip Hop & Pow Wows Collide - Santa Fe – Early this year a video of two unidentified young females dancing at an outdoor pow-wow in their regalia, hip-hop style, was circulated among Native Americans all over the nation. Since then, their dancing has been the center of controversy among pow-wow goers. In the video, the astonished audience in the background watch the two girls shake their bottoms to the ground as if they were in a nightclub. Moreover, one young woman dancing in her jingle dress performs a split like a teenage cheerleader and bounces on the ground. The CHRONICLE gathered reaction to the dancing from across Indian country. “Native American dances in general do not have outwardly sexual or dance movements that mimic sexual intimacy,” said Tamara Francis, cultural preservation specialist of the Caddo, Delaware, Pawnee, and Muskogee tribes. Chuck Butzin, visitor service representative of the Ziibiwing Center of Anishinabe Culture and Lifeways, who is part Ojibway and part-German from Mt. Pleasant, Mich., said, “The girl shouldn’t be in that dress while dancing in that manner. The dress was given to us (Ojibway) for healing purposes, not to shake your booty in it. The dress has a story behind it that she should respect.”............ (((The rest of the article/pictures and video footage can be read and viewed here at this link: http://www.iaiachronicle.org/archives/HipHopPowWows.htm ))) Last edited by dancingfancy; 01-18-2007 at 01:15 PM. Reason: just cause

01-18-2007, 05:46 PM	#2 (permalink)
bushy_braids cool...calm...collected Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: da CROW wide world Posts: 1,175	just for clarification... people draw conclusions way too quickly and take things out of porportion i know exactly what video you're talkin' bout and along w/the e-mail was something like "how ndns on the east coast powwow" and that was wrong... the story behind it is this: the group that hosts certain powwows in ny and nj have dance competitions during their breaks. they play rap music and have the ndns dance like they're in the club and then they play powwow music and have the spectators dance like ndns. that's where the booty shakin' video and dance came from. everyone gets out there and shakes a tail feather and laughs at each other and who ever gets the most cheers, of course wins. i'm not saying it's right for the girl to go out there and shake her booty and do the splits and this and that... but that's what she chose to do in her outfit in the powwow circle during a special dance that was held probably during a break. what can ya do? i've also seen many edgy videos of switch dancers doing the same thing, but not as many people were outraged... what's the difference if its all in fun? i guess it's how the people choose to act up in attempts to win... __________________ "i don't like to walk fast man - i like to strut!"

01-30-2007, 06:13 PM	#5 (permalink)
kgirl7 Hola! Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: AZ Posts: 329	I didn't like the dance in the jingle dress but I thought the fancy dress was fine. I've seen male switch dancers put on a jingle dress and dance and behave 10 times worse. __________________ Cariblanguage.org

03-05-2007, 08:37 PM	#8 (permalink)
n8iveFancii43 MushkoBinasi_12 Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: just moved to Baldwin,WI Posts: 12	ok, well i have to STRONGLY disagree with you on that one. i for one and as well as many of my friends on the trail do NOT make a mockery out of the culture. we simply like to have fun. that is not a crime and it does not mean that we do not respect our culture. we are simply trying to have fun while learning our culture. and when it comes to those specials, those are not decided by the youth they are decided by the arena directors and so therefore its not the youth making a mockery its the ADULTS that are making the decision to have some fun as well. so all i can say is that im sorry that you feel that way. but its not how it is AT ALL. __________________ RePPin thAt IcE wOlF<3 maDD loVe fER thA crEw <33 dReamma

03-11-2007, 01:46 AM	#9 (permalink)
nativeproud Young Tsalagi man Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Oklahoma (wish it were Kansas) Posts: 138	now im gonna have to strongly disagree with you. what these girls are doing is wrong, now i also dont know much about jingle or fancy shaw dancing, but i do know they are very sacred things. if they wanna go out and dance like that, thats fine, just dont do it in dance cloths, they are sacred things and should be used for the sacred dances they are intended for. if they want to dance like that, they should do it in their street clothes, i dont think anyone would have any problem with that. __________________ "There is no such thing as 'part Cherokee.' Either you're Cherokee or you're not. It isn't the quantity of Cherokee blood in your veins that is important, but the quality of it...your pride in it. I have seen full-bloods who have virtually no idea of the great legacy entrusted to their care. Yet, I have seen people with as little as 1/500th blood quantum who inspire the spirits of their ancestors because they make being Cherokee a proud part of a their everyday life." -Jim Pell, Principal Chief of the North Alabama Cherokee

01-29-2007, 09:46 PM	#4 (permalink)
lclbcook Tiny Tot Dancer Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: ponca city Posts: 40	yeah what can u do. todays younger generation just makes a mockery out of our culture, and people see that and think its cute. its sad.

04-20-2007, 02:11 AM	#10 (permalink)
OneidaDreamer PowWows.com Addicts Join Date: May 2006 Location: My Woman's Rez Posts: 2,282	Booty Dance Rap is not even on the same Plane of Existance as True Hip-Hop I"m gonna have to go ahead and disagree with the whole article's use of the term 'HIP-HOP'. I'm 99.99% sure that they weren't shakin their tail feathers to Real Hip-Hop Music out there. It was RAP Music. A b@$t@rd-step-child of Hip-Hop Music. For those of you who don't know the difference or may think you do; you'd better stop by my post entitled Hip-Hop Culture Amongst Turtle Islanders. And if you disagree with me about the intricacies of Rap and Hip-Hop then you obviously don't know what your talking about. As far as those people doing all that booty dancing out there in the circle. No comment... Peace O.D. __________________ Last edited by OneidaDreamer; 04-20-2007 at 02:18 AM.