Off Beat Songs

Brackett481 · 03-22-2006, 08:50 PM

Are all songs supposed to be sung off beat, or are there some that are sung on beat? This has come up a few times with some of the songs I was taught. I was taught a song by someone only to have someone else either related to the writer, or the actual writer himself correct me on it. I would be greatful for help.

Does this differ from northern to southern?

**Wojapi4Me** · 03-23-2006, 09:05 AM

I've never heard of any song that is supposed to be sung on beat. They may exist, but I don't know any and have never heard of any.

But, then again, maybe all songs are supposed to be sung on beat when in the state of Alabama? But, when you leave the state they are sung off beat again

Mato Winyan · 03-23-2006, 11:30 AM

**chazziff** · 03-23-2006, 11:35 AM

danbear · 03-23-2006, 12:20 PM

alot of those songs we were taught i imagine were originally off beat and who gave us those songs changed them to on beat cawz they couldn't sing off beat, those songs are northern songs so im pretty sure they're sung off beat. but i don't know...maybe maybe not, now all the songs i sing are off beat....i've thought about this a time or two myself

**chazziff** · 03-23-2006, 12:30 PM

how does one even start to sing on beat? - my hubby just does it to make me laff .. lol. is it just certain lead singers who get the rest of their singers to sing like them? i guess you can only learn what's taught to you ...

WhoMe · 03-23-2006, 01:03 PM

What exactly IS on beat, off beat?

Is it like wax on, wax off?

danbear · 03-23-2006, 01:25 PM

whome, sing on the up beat of the drum, to sing on beat with the drum would be to start the lead on top/same time as the stick strikes the drum, to sing off beat is to start the lead between the beats. not sure if that makes since, but the best way to explain it or say you take 4 beats 1 2 3 4, 1&3 would be your down beat(striking the drum and 2&4 would be your up beat(or off beat when the stick is in the air) to sing on the down beat you'd start singin on the count of one if you were to sing offbeat you'd sing on the count of 2 or the off beat...well crap i hope that makes since

WhoMe · 03-23-2006, 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by danbear

whome, sing on the up beat of the drum, to sing on beat with the drum would be to start the lead on top/same time as the stick strikes the drum, to sing off beat is to start the lead between the beats. not sure if that makes since, but the best way to explain it or say you take 4 beats 1 2 3 4, 1&3 would be your down beat(striking the drum and 2&4 would be your up beat(or off beat when the stick is in the air) to sing on the down beat you'd start singin on the count of one if you were to sing offbeat you'd sing on the count of 2 or the off beat...well crap i hope that makes since

danbear,

I've never heard of powwow music being broken down like that, in musical terms.

Heck, I just start beating and sing ... and the people dance!

I wonder what I sing? On beat, or off beat - wax on, or wax off?

Heck, I dont' even care .... just as long as the people dance!

suthernwaterbird · 03-23-2006, 02:48 PM

Never sing on beat. Ruins the song. Often ruins the dance, and commonly recieves negative feedback to the drum and singers. Take the advice, and use it. That is if you want to improve your current reputation.

Brackett481 · 03-23-2006, 03:34 PM

All of the songs I know how to sing, I was taught to sing on beat. I have very rarely heard any complaint or had someone correct me or the drum i sing with.

danbear · 03-23-2006, 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WhoMe

danbear,

I've never heard of powwow music being broken down like that, in musical terms.

Heck, I just start beating and sing ... and the people dance!

I wonder what I sing? On beat, or off beat - wax on, or wax off?

Heck, I dont' even care .... just as long as the people dance!

pretty sure you sing correctly and sing off beat??? any form of music can be broken down in "musical terms" i've seen songs put into music notation as well, but like you i just starting drumming and singin...but when i 1st started drumming i was taught to drum onbeat and that is obviously incorrect and i have been taught to sing off beat by some generous people(jeff, jackie, jake, gazer, steven,etc.) a good friend and myself were ask to sing with them and they were nice enough to show us the correct way to drum...or whatever well i sing like i'm supposed to now...

stomp · 03-23-2006, 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by suthernwaterbird

Never sing on beat. Ruins the song. Often ruins the dance, and commonly recieves negative feedback to the drum and singers. Take the advice, and use it. That is if you want to improve your current reputation.

And negative depressed feeling from the dancers! Very hard to dance to on beat! Very hard to stay "upbeat" and happy when it doesn't sound right....boy this is a good place to talk about this, finally....

**Wojapi4Me** · 03-23-2006, 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brackett481

All of the songs I know how to sing, I was taught to sing on beat. I have very rarely heard any complaint or had someone correct me or the drum i sing with.

Its hard to tell, but it seems like you're arguing with us.

If so, keep on singing on beat...but please stay in Alabama...the rest of us in Pow Wow Country don't want to have to hear it.

Oh, and get new teachers, mentors, or whatever you guys call them.

danbear · 03-23-2006, 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Singerdad

Its hard to tell, but it seems like you're arguing with us.

If so, keep on singing on beat...but please stay in Alabama...the rest of us in Pow Wow Country don't want to have to hear it.

Oh, and get new teachers, mentors, or whatever you guys call them.

well, man you've heard me i don't sing on be

03-22-2006, 08:50 PM	#1 (permalink)
Brackett481 Drummer and Dancer Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Out of Style Southern State Posts: 27	Off Beat Songs Are all songs supposed to be sung off beat, or are there some that are sung on beat? This has come up a few times with some of the songs I was taught. I was taught a song by someone only to have someone else either related to the writer, or the actual writer himself correct me on it. I would be greatful for help. Does this differ from northern to southern?

03-23-2006, 09:05 AM	#2 (permalink)
Wojapi4Me Kili! Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Tha Rez Posts: 1,515	I've never heard of any song that is supposed to be sung on beat. They may exist, but I don't know any and have never heard of any. But, then again, maybe all songs are supposed to be sung on beat when in the state of Alabama? But, when you leave the state they are sung off beat again __________________ If pro is the opposite of con, then wouldn't progress be the opposite of...lol

03-23-2006, 11:30 AM	#3 (permalink)
Mato Winyan Gangster of Love Join Date: Mar 2000 Location: Indiana Posts: 5,497 Blog Entries: 4	__________________ "We see it as a desecration not only of a mountain but of our way of life. This is a genocidal issue to us. If they kill this mountain, they kill our way of life." ~Debra White Plume

03-23-2006, 11:35 AM	#4 (permalink)
chazziff YO!! Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: in a big sleigh bed Posts: 6,514	__________________ See I wanna move, but can't escape from you So I keep it low, keep a secret code So everybody else don't have to know So keep ya love locked down

03-23-2006, 12:20 PM	#5 (permalink)
danbear CROW BEAR Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: the woods Posts: 94	those songs alot of those songs we were taught i imagine were originally off beat and who gave us those songs changed them to on beat cawz they couldn't sing off beat, those songs are northern songs so im pretty sure they're sung off beat. but i don't know...maybe maybe not, now all the songs i sing are off beat....i've thought about this a time or two myself

03-23-2006, 12:30 PM	#6 (permalink)
chazziff YO!! Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: in a big sleigh bed Posts: 6,514	how does one even start to sing on beat? - my hubby just does it to make me laff .. lol. is it just certain lead singers who get the rest of their singers to sing like them? i guess you can only learn what's taught to you ... __________________ See I wanna move, but can't escape from you So I keep it low, keep a secret code So everybody else don't have to know So keep ya love locked down

03-23-2006, 01:03 PM	#7 (permalink)
WhoMe PauWau Coordinator Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Land of 370 Broken Treaties Posts: 5,560	What exactly IS on beat, off beat? Is it like wax on, wax off? __________________ "Today, recognizing and respecting the origins of powwow aids in our Cultural Survival. If enough people break the rules because they are not satisfied...."We will have no culture." WhoMe

03-23-2006, 01:25 PM	#8 (permalink)
danbear CROW BEAR Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: the woods Posts: 94	from a musical stand point whome, sing on the up beat of the drum, to sing on beat with the drum would be to start the lead on top/same time as the stick strikes the drum, to sing off beat is to start the lead between the beats. not sure if that makes since, but the best way to explain it or say you take 4 beats 1 2 3 4, 1&3 would be your down beat(striking the drum and 2&4 would be your up beat(or off beat when the stick is in the air) to sing on the down beat you'd start singin on the count of one if you were to sing offbeat you'd sing on the count of 2 or the off beat...well crap i hope that makes since

03-23-2006, 02:48 PM	#10 (permalink)
suthernwaterbird nobody Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: atl, ga Posts: 1,004	Never sing on beat. Ruins the song. Often ruins the dance, and commonly recieves negative feedback to the drum and singers. Take the advice, and use it. That is if you want to improve your current reputation. __________________ WhY yOu AsK? bEcUz We CaN!

03-23-2006, 03:34 PM	#11 (permalink)
Brackett481 Drummer and Dancer Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Out of Style Southern State Posts: 27	The way I was taught... All of the songs I know how to sing, I was taught to sing on beat. I have very rarely heard any complaint or had someone correct me or the drum i sing with.