T.O.T.E.

wow i bet you lums just love that title. but you still talk about how the government has been sticking you over the years. Why do you continue to follow by that fake name find out who you really are stop wandering search for the truth its out there many others found it and you can too. make your ancestors proud and bring back there traditonal name to this land and you will be a stronger minded person and i promise you will be proud of who you really are. why do they keep changing were they come from? they cant keep there lie strait. the lies are running out. why do they come to the tuscarora and ask them questions about makeing ceromonies? they have none. why to they want to learn the tuscarora language, woops,I thought they were a cheraw speaking language, woops again cheraw was a tribe that was wiped out after the wars from 1711-1713. now they are saying they are sioun speaking people, but arent the wacamaw a sioun speaking tribe but a few years ago the lumbee said there was no relation between the two but know they claim there bloods. shame, now they are stealing blood. why is it when you go up to one of there historians they either drop there heads and walk away or they are always confused about the history lesson you just give them. the croatan indian normal school was just a big setup to brainwash the people here and teach them the lies and it worked for some but not all. they used the same tuscarora migration pattern but just changed the tribal name to cheraw, but they use to say the cheraw came from south carolina, you see all they do is sit around and think up new lies to tell the people and the government but why do they try and fool the government who created them and knows who they really are. but they want to play dumb and act blind. God did not create the lumbee the white man did so why would you want to be apart of something not of God. but he did create the tuscarora and all the other real tirbes of the world and there language ,ceromonies,traditions,clans,goverment but all the lumbee can do is go back to 1956 were it all was created. THE BIG LIE!!!!!!!!look in the dictionary it will tell you were lumbee came from.


NYa-WE!!!! to our ancestor who faught to keep our name strong and alive and we will continue to fight till we get justice we will do what ever it takes.

T.O.T.E. Tuscaroras Of The East since creation

Roskerah

Chwe'n,

To back up what TOTE is saying, check this out:
http://www.skarorehkatenuakanation.o...hronology.html

This may help to clear up any misconceptions that most here evidently have regarding this issue. For the people who claim Lumbee at the moment, take what you find to your so-called "leaders", and ask them to verify what is written. Then, come back and report your findings.

If you ever wondered why your leaders never told you about your ancestors past prior to 1956, this information may help you to understand why you have had that feeling in your heart that something was missing. It has never been missing, just "hidden".

Like the Mohawk said to us when they helped teach the Great Law years ago; "don't take our word for it, take this information, digest it, and make up your own mind"

You, the "grass roots" Lumbee here have been victoms of genocide your whole life, but only you, can take your destiny back into your own hands.

Ooneh,
Chris

Wojapi4Me

Last week I had the pleasure of meeting the Lumbee Tribal Ambassadors when they came for a visit to the Cherokee reservation. Little Miss Lumbee, Junior Miss Lumbee, Teen Miss Lumbee, and Miss Lumbee all visited in addition to their chaperones and they were very nice young women who represent their tribe very well. They were actually some of most well-spoken tribal representatives I've ever come in contact with. I learned some of their tribe and traditions which was interesting because everything I've heard about them has sort of demonized them in my eyes, but that was based on ignorance and not facts.

True, there was no historic Lumbee Tribe, but there also was no historic Three Affiliated Tribes or Cheyenne River Sioux Tribe. The Three Affiliated Tribes is comprised of Mandan, Hidatsa and Arikara peoples while the Cheyenne River Sioux Tribe is comprised of Mniconjou Lakota, Itazipco Lakota, Sihasapa Lakota, and Oohenumpa Lakota peoples. The point is that these tribes are comprised of various groups of people just as the Lumbee Tribe is comprised of various groups of people coming together under a new name. What's the big deal and what's the difference?

__________________
If pro is the opposite of con, then wouldn't progress be the opposite of...lol

godstomp

Thanks Singerdad,

Finally someone who knows. Its so sad that these "Tuscarora" wannabes don't get out of N.C. much. Then they'd see the truth for themselves. These people know nothing about unity. The group began in the late 60's because they were upset that the Indian schools were being integrated. Its early roots also stemmed from violence, and we all know that violence brings about destruction of a nation. They also claim Tuscarora as a group without even checking their geneology to see if they really do have Tuscarora blooodlines. Of course, a few of the Lumbee do have that ancestry. But as I said only "a few" can claim it, not ALL these people. Sooo tell me T.O.T.E, do you agree that not all Lumbees have Tuscarora blood?

so STOP your little mission to try to tell an entire people who they are or are not. You ain't God are you? If you want to rant and rave go to NY and see if they'll let you at the next Grand Council meeting. HA!

Godstomp

godstomp

So tell me,

Why do Tuscaroras go to the Lumbee tribal offices and sign up for housing assistance? I know some of you hardcore "Tuscaroras" who've done that. Yep, I sure do and I could mention names JOHNSBOY. If you are so anti-Lumbee then don't come seeking our services. Screw that! If you going to be an outkast and down your own people, then you can march yourselfs right up north and join the Tuscaroras. How bout that?

Roskerah

Chwe'n,
Singerdad, granted, I will give the benefit of the doubt in regards to more than one tribal affiliation here. But, my problem is with "WHY" the name Lumbee came into existence. Why, was to cover-up the people primary blood, which is Tuscarora. The Lumbee (LRDA) did the research and came up with the same scenario. More importantly, these tribes you mentioned from out west, were still able to assert their treaties that were signed prior to the "new" designations, as individual tribes.

Now, when the Lumbee hearings were taking place, D.F. Lowry spoke of about five tribes here, Tuscarora being one of them, and Cheraw never being mentioned. Then, when you look at the final language of the Act, it makes sure not to give any rights that other "tribes" have, including "TREATY" rights. There were several treaties that Tuscarora were party to prior to removal to New York, and which the people here are party to today. But, not as "LUMBEE". the people automatically give up those rights with accepting that name, plain and simple.

Now, Godstomp. You say these things about how Tuscarora reemerged as a bad thing. I see it as a good things, because it shows that the fighting spirit has not died completely yet.

You said..."They also claim Tuscarora as a group without even checking their geneology to see if they really do have Tuscarora blooodlines. Of course, a few of the Lumbee do have that ancestry. But as I said only "a few" can claim it, not ALL these people.

I don't know your background Godstomp, but Locklears, Lowrys, Jacobs, Brayboys, Hunts, Brooks, Sampson, Brewington, Oxendine, Ransom, Chance, Freeman, Revels, Jones, Chavis, Goins, and others, trace back to Tuscarora originally. (LRDA "settlement pattern study" 1983 by Wes White and Rebecca Seibs, and Carol Oxendine" if you want to doublecheck me)

As far as I am concerned, instead of only a "few" that can claim it, only a few "CAN"T" claim it.

Next, yeah there are Tuscarora who go to try and get assistance for housing, but that is because HUD monies is "SUPPOSED" to be for all people, and not just Lumbee. These monies are competitive grants, which means that anyone can get them. The Lumbee chooses to discriminate against Tuscarora, forcing them to get Lumbee cards before serving them.
I was in a meeting years ago when the HUD people from Chicago came down. In the meeting, I asked if it was legal to deny Tuscarora from receiving any assistance, and Jame Hardin said that they serve all enrolled Lumbee 1st, then non-enrolled Lumbees, and then everybody else. We then asked if we could receive HUD grants ourselves, and we were told that we must accept "state recognition" before that happens. Immediately afterwards, the guy from HUD said that we could have the $500,000 that the Tuscarora in New York turn down everyyear.

Not to mention the fact that the Lumbee got their first million dollar grant off the heels of the Maynor V. Morton lawsuit in 1975, from CETA.

Since then, the Lumbee have put down and disrepect Tuscarora, saying that we are only "disgruntled" , and "renegade Lumbees".

You Godstomp may not be primarily Tuscarora. Again I don't know who you are by your handle, but that does not mean that a majority of the people here are not Tuscarora. Did you even look at the link I posted? Please do.

The conspiracy to cover up the people's name began in 1885 on February 10th by Hamilton McMillan. This is the day that the name Croatan was passed into law. Two days later, in the Fayetteville Observer, an article on the people here was reprinted from a Asheville newspaper weeks before. In it, it says..."They say that their traditions say that the people we call the Croatan Indians (though they do not recognize that name as that of a tribe, but only a village, and that they were Tuscaroras), were always friendly to the whites; and finding them destitute and despairing of ever receiving aid from England, persuaded them to leave the Island, and go to the mainland.…They gradually drifted away from their original seats, and at length settled in Robeson, about the center of the county.

Now, McMillan Knew what our people's oral traditions were weeks before the law was passed, yet he chose to pass the "FIRST" of many fictitious names that would follow. Look it up. Go to the library and get the Mircofilm for the Fayetteville observer for Feb 12, 1885, and see for yourself. Or go here: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NCTuscarora/ join, and you will see it all here.

Ooneh,
Chris

CandaePrincess

what's a tirbe????




*L* j/k

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Mussy by birth.....Native by the Grace of God.......

Roskerah

Chwe'n,
That is what the government created when they passed the Lumbee Act.

Wojapi4Me

[quote=CandaePrincess]what's a tirbe????/QUOTE]

A tirbe (tuhr-bee) is an Indian Furbee...just in time for xmas!!

__________________
If pro is the opposite of con, then wouldn't progress be the opposite of...lol

CandaePrincess

[quote=Singerdad] LMFAO!!! That was too muss Singer.

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Mussy by birth.....Native by the Grace of God.......

geronimo

TOTE and other Tuscarora supporters,
You really need to think about how you fashion your arguments, how you even present them, down to the very last word. Because this thread really does harm to our tribe and our people, when viewed from an outsider's perspective. Even the thread title has negative connotations. "Fake" name, "Fake" tribe? People take things literally these days. It's called ignorance. And there's already enough of it floating around out there, when it comes to Indian people, and certainly when it comes to Lumbees. So, while it's fine for all of us to agree to disagree (or agree) please don't trash the legacy of "our" (yours and mine) people by voicing your opinions in a manner that can be "misconstrued", and possibly "divisive" and "hurtful".


BTW, Singerdad, I agree with you. And, thanks for the compliments for our queens. Miss Lumbee is a family friend and an outstanding young representative, in addition to all the other girls.

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No one can make you feel inferior w/o your consent-Eleanor Roosevelt

Roskerah

Chwe'n,
Geronimo, I mean no harm or disrespect in what I say and write. My whole family, except for my mother claim Lumbee, and we were also until only 13 years ago.

I know this may hurt some feelings now, but in the long run, most will thank us for what is said. I know you, and other who accept Lumbee are proud of your Native heritage which is just as strong as many other Nations today. I have no problem with the Lumbee "grassroots" people, who have been misled for the last 5 centuries by their own leaders who knows everything we are saying to be true.

I remember years ago when Natasha Wagnor was Miss Indian USA and at some function with Hillary Clinton. Hillary asked what the Lumbee language was, and the only thing Natasha could answer was the "Queen's english". This is what her leaders taught her while preparing her to go out representing her people. She did the best she could with what she knew. Unfortunately, many Native Nations laughed at, and ridiculed her for this, which I imagine hurt deeply.

We do have a language. We do have ceremonies. We do have a history longer than 50 years, but it is not Lumbee. Can you answer me why these things have not been taught in schools or any where else?

Ooneh,
Chris

Kiwehnzii

Every coupla months or so this subject comes up.

People like to bicker, I guess.

godstomp

T.O.T.E

But what does it really mean?

toe of the elephant?
touch of the erect?
toast on the egg?
tick on the ear?