Should jingle competition be separated between traditional and contemporary? - Page 3

Sweet Syilx · 01-09-2003, 08:28 AM

These two categories should be separated for sure!! I mean, I love watching the tradish jinglers do their thing, the grace of their dancing always takes my heart away. Granted, as the pow-wow trail evolves, of course our dancing will progress because our dancing is not captured within a time capsule (rather, our dancing is not frozen forever in time, but rather, always evolving with each generation), but there is such a big difference between the two. I love to see that jinglers creating new moves, but I also love seeing that the gracefulness of the old way being preserved as well. I live out west and I often see contemp. jinglers placing higher than tradish jinglers because the moves may seem more complex than the tradish moves. But I think that the judges have to remember and appreciate the dance steps that the tradish jinglers adhere to. There is such a difference and we have to remember that. I think that we have to be separated because tradish and contemp. have their own unique beauty.

R.

ctryprincess · 01-09-2003, 11:45 AM

Hello. My name is Shawna. I work at the radio staion on our reservation and have in this past year and a half learned a lot. There are so many variations to the Jingle dance. I've been to a lot of pow wows and have saw a lot of outfits. I've witnessed every type of dance these ladies do. Now, I may need some help from all of you. I've read this entire thread, every post. I loved it, thank you. My daughter is 2 years old. She's a very big girl. I'm right now making her jingle dress. Well, I've designed it, bought the fabrics. She will have a rather plain (one color) dress with sheer sleeves. I'll put ribbon on there, and she will also have a star on the back of her dress. Will putting more of the stars on there be too much? Like I was thinking on the bottom somewhere? It's a 6 sided star (starquilt) style, one row. It's a solid color (red). I also bought little rhinestone accents that I would like to accentuate the star like starbursts. Of course I'll put on the jingles not traditionally, day by day, by en masse. I will be teaching her to dance as well. I planned on her only moving her feet, hardly leaving the floor. Would that be disrespectful? Since this dance and dress are not native to our area (Wyoming), and she has no elder to teach her this dance? I've picked this up from a lot of dancers and this is how I'd like her to dance. I've also decided she will have no fan (she is very young) and she will have a plume in her hair, but it is only a turkey feather. I know that when she dances, these kids around here already have fans and plumes and they raise them. How can I teach her to use her hand? Is that disrespectful to the dance itself, given her age? And how do I address that area, when the other dancers raise their fans, what should she do?? I didn't vote in this category, because I wasn't too sure...

beefy_cheefy · 01-14-2003, 11:59 PM

I am a contemporary jingle dancer and i love it. I dont think it should matter whether a dancer dances old style or not, because as time goes on dance styles evolve and nothing stays the same, so i say that maybe they should separate the styles, because there is a BIG difference in betwwen the two styles. And if people think I'm less of a dancer because i choose to do more moves or try to be different and make an eye catching outfit . than that is their problem

beefy_cheefy · 01-15-2003, 12:03 AM

oh yeah, and sometimes there are certain places that are hard to place at because all they pick or prefer is old style, some times alll contmperary will win or only old style will win, but please dont slam those of us who prefer to try new things, just like womens fancy, now they wear capes, back then there were no capes.

n8tivechick · 01-15-2003, 07:11 PM

powwowlovers... I totally understand what you are talking about and that is why i started this thread. I think that if you want to me comtemp then go ahead! You are just as good either way! But i meant this to be cause of jugding and well i think judgeing will never change.... but oh well.

~Kelli

beefy_cheefy · 01-16-2003, 01:32 AM

yeah, i totally understand, It just hard to place when you go somewhere that prefers old style, and when peole on here put down contemporary. But all i have to say is that yes they should separate us, like they do at schemitzun.

native_flutterby · 01-19-2003, 01:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by powwow_lovers
yeah, i totally understand, It just hard to place when you go somewhere that prefers old style, and when peole on here put down contemporary. But all i have to say is that yes they should separate us, like they do at schemitzun.

that was the whole point of the poll was it not? and as an OS Jingler i dont see the contmp as bad i see it as an evoveld form of what was. it fits the life and times of the people, but contemp should remember where it's roots lay, I have a strong understanding that if you don't know your past you'll never know your future, and all is lost. Which is why I like being OS. I danced Contemp a coupla times, didnt like it much felt guilty, was kinda fun, won a few times with it, never felt more slutty, so i went back to OS. It's all about where a person feels comfortable I think. I guess what I'm trying to say is, If a person wants to kick up her heels to feel good, then good for her, but if a person likes to keep grounded then good for her too. but for competition reasons those who compete with the old style it should be seperated. Now that i think about it those old ladies used to dance for money at the pow wows, 'cept there competition relied on a hat or bucket. they'd place a bucket on the ground an dance the people placed money in the bucket or hat of there fav. dancer, whoever had the most money was the winner...but that was back in my great gram's day...where a person could be the winner of 5 bucks and be very happy...

***Kwe_Zee*** · 01-20-2003, 06:32 PM

I agree with ya flutterby! Keep it real ladies...

**~*~ShanLyn~*~** · 01-20-2003, 07:47 PM

i also totally agree..............:D

but ok, heres my deal though, contemporary can get like waaay contemporary and i mean i dont dance old style but then i dont dance all way crazy contemporary......so then theres middle ground too.....sooo i mean theres always gonna be some kinda controversy over judgin, what to judge how to judge, who places etc etc etc.........sooo i dont get my panties all in a twist over it.....:D i do muh thang, sum places like the contemporary, some places like the old style, and then theres places that like the not so fancy contemporary....so meh! let it beee let it beee

**Jinglin Chica** · 01-21-2003, 03:34 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by shannon_lynn
i mean i dont dance old style but then i dont dance all way crazy contemporary......so then theres middle ground too

Hey! Thatz me too! :D Guess we're stuck in the middle Shannon

beefy_cheefy · 01-24-2003, 02:07 PM

I totally understand about knowing what our dance is all about, why it is danced and so on, but what I meant is that the style is so different from what it was, that there needs to be a separation for sure, and hopefully places will begin to separate us. But all in all, I dont mind dancing with Old style, we do dance to the same beat, and we do wear the same outfits, but we only dance a little different. I would have to say that most of us who call are senves contemporary are not Wild, or Crazy, but we are in the middle, I'm not wild or psycho when I dance, I am still graceful in my foot work. :D But I hope Powwow Committees will see this site and hopefully we will get separated. Especially at gathering of Nations, because it's always contemporary that place. Oh and POst Falls, and Shokopee. Small powwows can keep us together though, cause it's fun to dance against alot of people. I love the dance, I love the dresses, and I love the competition. I switched from fancy to jingle. I will never switch to any thing else.

southernx_hunnie08 · 06-24-2005, 06:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by beefy_cheefy

I totally understand about knowing what our dance is all about, why it is danced and so on, but what I meant is that the style is so different from what it was, that there needs to be a separation for sure, and hopefully places will begin to separate us. But all in all, I dont mind dancing with Old style, we do dance to the same beat, and we do wear the same outfits, but we only dance a little different. I would have to say that most of us who call are senves contemporary are not Wild, or Crazy, but we are in the middle, I'm not wild or psycho when I dance, I am still graceful in my foot work. :D But I hope Powwow Committees will see this site and hopefully we will get separated. Especially at gathering of Nations, because it's always contemporary that place. Oh and POst Falls, and Shokopee. Small powwows can keep us together though, cause it's fun to dance against alot of people. I love the dance, I love the dresses, and I love the competition. I switched from fancy to jingle. I will never switch to any thing else.

holy heck that is kind what i am thinking on this thread i dance both contemp and triditional, but yeah for sure at the bigger pow wows they should seperate us but at the smaller ones they should keeps us together but so do a special for triditional jingle...

**ojibwaysweetie** · 07-15-2005, 11:31 AM

Boozhoo/Ahneen My Fellow Anishnabe Ikwes and hello to all jinglers!

Vedde Vedde Interesting. *hehee*.

Seperate the two! Afterall, before the coming of the contemporary style there was no other way to jingle but Old Style. The true way. I myself is an old style jingler and because I do believe strongly in the old way of the dress - fact of the matter is - the contemp style will always be around now. The flashiness, the high steppin, the plumes, the big fans all take the "realness" away, not to mention the traditional protocol which has to be done when the dress is complete. Heck I even do a few fancy steps and I even have a little bit of flash on couple dress..lol...but I keep it low enough that my old style still shines. Perhaps my little bit of flash and a few fancy steps are my own way of acknowledging that the contemp jinglers are beautiful too. When we all dance our exhibition together, every one of us makes for that dance a beautiful one. Sometime there are so many of us, the people watching have some difficulty hearing the drum for the sound of our jingles all making that beautiful sound together.

So, no matter the style, whether it is the true old style, whether it is the contemp style, I'll always say that it leaves me content and so damn proud that I am Anishnabe Ikwe.......the true owners of the Jingle Dress. We know what has to be done and thats what matters.

*hugs and love to all*

ojibwaysweetie

jingle-babygirl · 07-15-2005, 07:34 PM

this topic needs to be considered when pw committes come together...they are too separated catogories...i love to go out there and just jam out with my moves but i really don't like it when i lose to someone dancing old style but i do get that they are dancing the true style...but it needs to be separated!!

View Poll Results: Should jingle competition be separated between the traditional and contemporary steps
YES!!!! They need to decide on what one to judge.	123	77.36%
Maybe... I kinda like it the way it is.	13	8.18%
NO!!! Keep it the way it is, I think it's all the same.	11	6.92%
I'm not sure.	12	7.55%
Voters: 159. You may not vote on this poll

01-09-2003, 11:45 AM	#42 (permalink)
ctryprincess Private Dancer Join Date: May 2002 Location: Wind River Country Posts: 150	Hello. My name is Shawna. I work at the radio staion on our reservation and have in this past year and a half learned a lot. There are so many variations to the Jingle dance. I've been to a lot of pow wows and have saw a lot of outfits. I've witnessed every type of dance these ladies do. Now, I may need some help from all of you. I've read this entire thread, every post. I loved it, thank you. My daughter is 2 years old. She's a very big girl. I'm right now making her jingle dress. Well, I've designed it, bought the fabrics. She will have a rather plain (one color) dress with sheer sleeves. I'll put ribbon on there, and she will also have a star on the back of her dress. Will putting more of the stars on there be too much? Like I was thinking on the bottom somewhere? It's a 6 sided star (starquilt) style, one row. It's a solid color (red). I also bought little rhinestone accents that I would like to accentuate the star like starbursts. Of course I'll put on the jingles not traditionally, day by day, by en masse. I will be teaching her to dance as well. I planned on her only moving her feet, hardly leaving the floor. Would that be disrespectful? Since this dance and dress are not native to our area (Wyoming), and she has no elder to teach her this dance? I've picked this up from a lot of dancers and this is how I'd like her to dance. I've also decided she will have no fan (she is very young) and she will have a plume in her hair, but it is only a turkey feather. I know that when she dances, these kids around here already have fans and plumes and they raise them. How can I teach her to use her hand? Is that disrespectful to the dance itself, given her age? And how do I address that area, when the other dancers raise their fans, what should she do?? I didn't vote in this category, because I wasn't too sure... __________________ :p cool indin woman :p

01-15-2003, 07:11 PM	#45 (permalink)
n8tivechick Jinglin fool... Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: YES! There really is a Kalamazoo, Michigan! Posts: 321	powwowlovers... I totally understand what you are talking about and that is why i started this thread. I think that if you want to me comtemp then go ahead! You are just as good either way! But i meant this to be cause of jugding and well i think judgeing will never change.... but oh well. ~Kelli __________________ If you lose the drum beat of the creator, you are lost in life - Aanishnabe You say I don't look indian? Well you don't look stupid, but looks can be deceiving!

01-20-2003, 07:47 PM	#49 (permalink)
*~~ShanLyn~~* Addy's Mommy Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: ¤(¯`·._»Pistons Country«_.·´¯)¤ Posts: 4,042	i also totally agree..............:D but ok, heres my deal though, contemporary can get like waaay contemporary and i mean i dont dance old style but then i dont dance all way crazy contemporary......so then theres middle ground too.....sooo i mean theres always gonna be some kinda controversy over judgin, what to judge how to judge, who places etc etc etc.........sooo i dont get my panties all in a twist over it.....:D i do muh thang, sum places like the contemporary, some places like the old style, and then theres places that like the not so fancy contemporary....so meh! let it beee let it beee __________________ **~~¤(¯`·._» >The Prettiest People do the Ugliest things <«_.·´¯)¤ ~~**

07-15-2005, 11:31 AM	#53 (permalink)
ojibwaysweetie PowWows.com Addicts Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Heart of the Great Lakes, Ontario Canada Posts: 4,981	Seperate the two styles! Boozhoo/Ahneen My Fellow Anishnabe Ikwes and hello to all jinglers! Vedde Vedde Interesting. hehee. Seperate the two! Afterall, before the coming of the contemporary style there was no other way to jingle but Old Style. The true way. I myself is an old style jingler and because I do believe strongly in the old way of the dress - fact of the matter is - the contemp style will always be around now. The flashiness, the high steppin, the plumes, the big fans all take the "realness" away, not to mention the traditional protocol which has to be done when the dress is complete. Heck I even do a few fancy steps and I even have a little bit of flash on couple dress..lol...but I keep it low enough that my old style still shines. Perhaps my little bit of flash and a few fancy steps are my own way of acknowledging that the contemp jinglers are beautiful too. When we all dance our exhibition together, every one of us makes for that dance a beautiful one. Sometime there are so many of us, the people watching have some difficulty hearing the drum for the sound of our jingles all making that beautiful sound together. So, no matter the style, whether it is the true old style, whether it is the contemp style, I'll always say that it leaves me content and so damn proud that I am Anishnabe Ikwe.......the true owners of the Jingle Dress. We know what has to be done and thats what matters. hugs and love to all ojibwaysweetie __________________ "Gaa wiin daa-aangoshkigaazo ahaw enaabiyaan gaa-inaabid"

01-09-2003, 08:28 AM	#41 (permalink)
Sweet Syilx V-Style Jingler Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: North Vancouver - Coast Salish Territory Posts: 248	These two categories should be separated for sure!! I mean, I love watching the tradish jinglers do their thing, the grace of their dancing always takes my heart away. Granted, as the pow-wow trail evolves, of course our dancing will progress because our dancing is not captured within a time capsule (rather, our dancing is not frozen forever in time, but rather, always evolving with each generation), but there is such a big difference between the two. I love to see that jinglers creating new moves, but I also love seeing that the gracefulness of the old way being preserved as well. I live out west and I often see contemp. jinglers placing higher than tradish jinglers because the moves may seem more complex than the tradish moves. But I think that the judges have to remember and appreciate the dance steps that the tradish jinglers adhere to. There is such a difference and we have to remember that. I think that we have to be separated because tradish and contemp. have their own unique beauty. R.

01-14-2003, 11:59 PM	#43 (permalink)
beefy_cheefy Junior Dancer Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 129	I am a contemporary jingle dancer and i love it. I dont think it should matter whether a dancer dances old style or not, because as time goes on dance styles evolve and nothing stays the same, so i say that maybe they should separate the styles, because there is a BIG difference in betwwen the two styles. And if people think I'm less of a dancer because i choose to do more moves or try to be different and make an eye catching outfit . than that is their problem

01-15-2003, 12:03 AM	#44 (permalink)
beefy_cheefy Junior Dancer Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 129	oh yeah, and sometimes there are certain places that are hard to place at because all they pick or prefer is old style, some times alll contmperary will win or only old style will win, but please dont slam those of us who prefer to try new things, just like womens fancy, now they wear capes, back then there were no capes.

01-16-2003, 01:32 AM	#46 (permalink)
beefy_cheefy Junior Dancer Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 129	yeah, i totally understand, It just hard to place when you go somewhere that prefers old style, and when peole on here put down contemporary. But all i have to say is that yes they should separate us, like they do at schemitzun.

01-20-2003, 06:32 PM	#48 (permalink)
*Kwe_Zee* is actually posting! Join Date: Apr 2000 Location: the AZ side.... Posts: 2,525	I agree with ya flutterby! Keep it real ladies...

01-24-2003, 02:07 PM	#51 (permalink)
beefy_cheefy Junior Dancer Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 129	I totally understand about knowing what our dance is all about, why it is danced and so on, but what I meant is that the style is so different from what it was, that there needs to be a separation for sure, and hopefully places will begin to separate us. But all in all, I dont mind dancing with Old style, we do dance to the same beat, and we do wear the same outfits, but we only dance a little different. I would have to say that most of us who call are senves contemporary are not Wild, or Crazy, but we are in the middle, I'm not wild or psycho when I dance, I am still graceful in my foot work. :D But I hope Powwow Committees will see this site and hopefully we will get separated. Especially at gathering of Nations, because it's always contemporary that place. Oh and POst Falls, and Shokopee. Small powwows can keep us together though, cause it's fun to dance against alot of people. I love the dance, I love the dresses, and I love the competition. I switched from fancy to jingle. I will never switch to any thing else.

07-15-2005, 07:34 PM	#54 (permalink)
jingle-babygirl Teen Dancer Join Date: May 2005 Location: here...there...i can't remember..but some where up north Posts: 346	this topic needs to be considered when pw committes come together...they are too separated catogories...i love to go out there and just jam out with my moves but i really don't like it when i lose to someone dancing old style but i do get that they are dancing the true style...but it needs to be separated!!