Plea for Advice!

debbieyd · 03-22-2006, 03:46 PM

I wrote about my grandson before and said he might be ADD or ADHD or something but anyway, I told my daughter that she should seek counseling, which she did, and now they are suggesting that she put her 4 year old son in a "Theraputic Foster Home" for some odd years!!! I thought these so called Family Counseling helped instead of passing the buck to another remedy! I'm so shocked about this event, and am very concerned about my grandson's impulsiveness, energy, and "no fear" attitude, any one got any advice for me? I'm afraid to put my grandson into a non Indian TFH and have him cry and throw fits about us neglecting him/abondoning him!

tsuj510 · 03-22-2006, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by debbieyd

I wrote about my grandson before and said he might be ADD or ADHD or something but anyway, I told my daughter that she should seek counseling, which she did, and now they are suggesting that she put her 4 year old son in a "Theraputic Foster Home" for some odd years!!! I thought these so called Family Counseling helped instead of passing the buck to another remedy! I'm so shocked about this event, and am very concerned about my grandson's impulsiveness, energy, and "no fear" attitude, any one got any advice for me? I'm afraid to put my grandson into a non Indian TFH and have him cry and throw fits about us neglecting him/abondoning him!

check your PM, debbieyd!

stomp · 03-22-2006, 03:55 PM

Second opinion. Family counseling somewhere else, with native people who understand. This solution they recommend seems very severe. I don't blame you for being alarmed. Maybe intervention is needed, but why not with mom included, so she can learn the skills she needs to raise her child? Talk to everyone and anyone who will listen. This is all I have to say. I am no pro in this area, just want to let you know my thoughts and morning prayers will be with you.

kiowakat · 03-22-2006, 04:05 PM

my opinion!!.... before you hand him over to "THE SYSTEM" foster homes....... is call around your area for self help groups that have the same problem, call hospitals and clinics every avenue you can, like dr. phil or oprah to see if there are such groups, the therapist is probably concerned that your not able to do it on your own and thats BS!!.... there are groups that will help and guide you and your family to stay together, with out DFS (divsion of family services) help. my 2 cents.

Blackbear · 03-22-2006, 04:51 PM

Sounds exactly like my little girl.. but no one suggested to put her in a therapeutic home... was this suggested because she refused the drug treatment?

Quote:

and am very concerned about my grandson's impulsiveness, energy, and "no fear" attitude,

My daughter is taking 36mg of Concerta (ridlin basicallly) and on 1 gram of this stuff called Risperdal. The concerta came after "sampling" several of the types of ADHD treatments out there without adverse effects (Adderol made my kid severly depressed). But it was'nt enough. The impulsivity issues had her in the middle of the street stopping traffic with her hand, and jumping ... ok lets put it this way... she was'nt making any good judgements and not thinking before acting on everything and she had no control over it either. No fear is a good way of describing it as you have... but also with the no fear she also did'nt feel , "guilt, humility, regret, or shame". In fact it was just last week she actually felt ashamed of something she did for the very first time in her almost 8 years of life!!!

The problem is that ADHD kids can have other small behavorial disorders along with it. And they mature mentally slower than other kids their age. That shame she felt was a sign she's maturing and that's why I'm so happy about it. But it was the risperdal that grounded her way of thinking so she could be in the "here and now" with us.

I know there are several non drug ways of going about this including dietary changes, but mine is a picky eater, and as dangerous as she was to herself at times, I did'nt take any chances and started her with the drugs. He growth has'nt been effected.

OH ONE MORE THING!!! This is very important and it's the hardest advice of all cause it means you might have to entertain the kid yourself more often.. but whatever you do... DO NOT LET THAT KID WATCH TOO MUCH TELEVISION. I'm serious. They told me that so many times and I did'nt listen because I could not get my stuff done constantly haveing to entertain her... but because of her refusal to clean her room, we took her TV away and for a good long time cause she's stubborn as a mule. But after 2 weeks of no TV and very limited TV time with the family... her attitude improved, her schoolwork improved, her reading improved, everything got like 100% better for her! Seems that TV is stimulation for the mind when we are trying to calm that mind down so it won't be so impulsive. Does that make sense? I had to find this out by reading about it cause none of the doctors ever explain it to you that simple.

debbieyd · 03-22-2006, 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blackbear

Sounds exactly like my little girl.. but no one suggested to put her in a therapeutic home... was this suggested because she refused the drug treatment?

My daughter is taking 36mg of Concerta (ridlin basicallly) and on 1 gram of this stuff called Risperdal. The concerta came after "sampling" several of the types of ADHD treatments out there without adverse effects (Adderol made my kid severly depressed). But it was'nt enough. The impulsivity issues had her in the middle of the street stopping traffic with her hand, and jumping ... ok lets put it this way... she was'nt making any good judgements and not thinking before acting on everything and she had no control over it either. No fear is a good way of describing it as you have... but also with the no fear she also did'nt feel , "guilt, humility, regret, or shame". In fact it was just last week she actually felt ashamed of something she did for the very first time in her almost 8 years of life!!!

The problem is that ADHD kids can have other small behavorial disorders along with it. And they mature mentally slower than other kids their age. That shame she felt was a sign she's maturing and that's why I'm so happy about it. But it was the risperdal that grounded her way of thinking so she could be in the "here and now" with us.

I know there are several non drug ways of going about this including dietary changes, but mine is a picky eater, and as dangerous as she was to herself at times, I did'nt take any chances and started her with the drugs. He growth has'nt been effected.

OH ONE MORE THING!!! This is very important and it's the hardest advice of all cause it means you might have to entertain the kid yourself more often.. but whatever you do... DO NOT LET THAT KID WATCH TOO MUCH TELEVISION. I'm serious. They told me that so many times and I did'nt listen because I could not get my stuff done constantly haveing to entertain her... but because of her refusal to clean her room, we took her TV away and for a good long time cause she's stubborn as a mule. But after 2 weeks of no TV and very limited TV time with the family... her attitude improved, her schoolwork improved, her reading improved, everything got like 100% better for her! Seems that TV is stimulation for the mind when we are trying to calm that mind down so it won't be so impulsive. Does that make sense? I had to find this out by reading about it cause none of the doctors ever explain it to you that simple.

It really helps when Indian people out there lend a helping hand and understand from experience! I know that tv is our babysitter most all the time, and I also know that it's a dangerous time too, for instance when the ninja thing comes on, he ran into the kitchen and grabbed two knives and stuck them in his shorts, pretending to put them in holsters I guess and then pulled them out pointing them at me, that was scary, he doesn't understand the dangers of things, but when he gets hurt, he blames people & things, but when he "accidentally hurts someone" he doesn't know or something. It's really complicating, and overwhelming to see your blood relative go thru this ordeal, it's really hard to take him in public. My daughter is trying to be alcohol free but her choices of friends and those dangerous places she goes to doesn't help her to stay sober! She's 26 years going on 16 sometimes!

debbieyd · 03-22-2006, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tsalaghisam

check your PM, debbieyd!

Yeah my daughter is 26 and a lot of times acts 16! She's my only child so I guess I spoiled her too much!? Anyway your PM stated ALL the good stuff he likes! what's left? our fishing season is put on hold over this way, so I guess I have to buy canned fish from safeway! as for our Longhouse, my family members scold him too much and seem to look down on his behaviors! Thanks so much for your advice.

Huronwoman · 03-23-2006, 03:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by debbieyd

I wrote about my grandson before and said he might be ADD or ADHD or something but anyway, I told my daughter that she should seek counseling, which she did, and now they are suggesting that she put her 4 year old son in a "Theraputic Foster Home" for some odd years!!! I thought these so called Family Counseling helped instead of passing the buck to another remedy! I'm so shocked about this event, and am very concerned about my grandson's impulsiveness, energy, and "no fear" attitude, any one got any advice for me? I'm afraid to put my grandson into a non Indian TFH and have him cry and throw fits about us neglecting him/abondoning him!

Wow they want to remove a 4 year old from his family for ADD??? Seems to me like a 2nd opinion is called for and I certainally would not give the child to anyone for any kind of "Theraputic Foster Care" I think that could only cause more harm than good. Perhaps a look at his diet and a discussion with the elders would be appropriate. I'm not a shrink but I did raise 1 child and now they are diagnosing alot of children with ADD or ADHD when there really isn't anything wrong with the child. Seek the advise of an elder or a NDN healer but I would fight to keep the child. My prayers are with you AHO

Blackbear · 03-23-2006, 06:53 AM

Kids that DO have ADHD cannot be denied that they have it... it only took a day or two of my kid without her meds to convince my mother that there was something not right with her behaviors and that she was'nt just another version of myself when I was a kid. They can be a huge danger to themselves and when they say they dont know why they did something... they honestly do not know! I know that's hard to comprehend but if you think of dumb things you did when drunk or overexecited in your life and then go, now what the hell did I do that for?? That's kinda what they are going through ALL THE TIME.

You know I hate to sound like an advocate for pharmaceutical companies, but the natural way on this one, (especially if he's as active as mine is like I'm betting he is) is a long slow process and some of us do not have the time, energy, patience and in some cases maturity to deal with it because it takes alot of commitment and research, especially with foods. But I just want to dispell a couple of misconceptions I know people have about adhd drugs because I had the same misconceptions myself.

1) They do not turn kids into zombie states. If they do, then your kid is not on the right drug or correct dosage.. go back to the doc and let him know. Your kid should be his own personality and energetic without all the bouncing off the walls and impulses. If your kid seems like its' in a normal state but you are'nt going batty or no longer have all the tension that you feel around them... it's working right.

2) They do not build up in the system, at least most don't. Just because they are amphetimenes.. it does not build up in your kid's system so that you have to slowly take them off the medicine, or lower the dosage to a safe level. Ridlin/Concerta, they do not even stay in their system 24/7 .. that's why there is the kind you give them twice a day, and the kind that is time released. This way if you want to make the choice of taking them off the drug for the summer when they are out of school you can do so, but as the doctors told me.. if it's not stunting their growth (which for some it can) and they are eating normally and sleeping good... then why put yourself through that. Remember, the drug does'nt just calm the kids down.. it helps them focus as well. Caffiene will do the same and that's why many of us feel more alert and focused after having a soda or coffee. However, caffiene is worse for them and is'nt time released, and is full of sugar.

Blackbear · 03-23-2006, 07:03 AM

Quote:

I'm not a shrink but I did raise 1 child and now they are diagnosing alot of children with ADD or ADHD when there really isn't anything wrong with the child.

You know I used to feel the EXACT same way and do still feel alot of children are misdiagnosed, but I've done alot of online reading and research on this, and talked with several doctors, nurses and other parents with kids with ADHD. It does have varying levels, and I would be less likely to believe an ADHD diagnosis for kids with very low levels and have them check into food allergies and such.
But you know.. after talking with doctors, psychiatrists... all the people who have done testing on my daughter psychologically and physically... I'm seeing alot of myself in her and now understand where she is comign from sometimes because I had a completly different way of comprehending things as a kid than most others did. And because there was'nt a diagnosis back then, we got labled as stupid, lazy or bad kids. I was'nt lazy.. I had a learning disability and could not and I mean absolutely could not concentrate on something for very long. Light coming through a window distracts me so badly I suddenly "come to" and realize I was just staring with NO thought in my head whatsoever.. or reading a book my mind will wander every other paragraph, but I can read a computer screen with less mind wandering because of it being backlit. Same with playing video games or watching TV.. backlit, holds my attention better. We did'nt have computers when I was in school though. And I started giving up on the teachers before they gave up on me because I could not get the support I needed.
I do not want my daughter to end up like that. And there is help for kids like that now because of these doctors diagnosises and labeling and I'm going to utilize everything I can that they offer to get her a good education and chance at life because she's not stupid, she's not lazy and she's not a bad kid.

indian-heart-beat · 03-23-2006, 08:39 AM

Hello,
my 7 years old son Silas has this Attention Deficite Disease (Hyperactive). So have I- but like many of those adults- I'm more the 'dreamer'. Concentrating is sometimes very hard. Albert Einstein had ADD. Most of them are intelligent, helpful, creative and justice-loving children. In Germany there are about 500.000 Children with ADD (ADS-ADHS...Syndrom instead of disease). ADDs always feel attacked. They are loosing selfrespect and sometimes become aggressive because of that. It is hard (for them and their parents, teachers,...) Sometimes medicine like RETALIN can help to let their brain-metabolism work better. Bad education can make this disease worse, but it still IS a disease! Family, teachers, friends, neighbors, all can help these children feel a bit better and it will reflect to them.
Only one example:
When I am trying to tell my son Silas: Please do your homework, now...nothing will happen but stress. I have to touch him, look him in the eyes and when I've got the feeling he notices this, then he is able to listen and to 'understand' what I told him. Otherwise- no chance.
(Playing soccer or basketball? No chance. But Kickbox-Jitsu helped very well. He is a very good tiny fighter!)
So I don't need to give him any hormon-medicine. Not yet.
I wish you the very best and
Please- don't think your grandson is a bad child. Never. He only needs some more chances than others. Some loving parents spending A LOT OF TIME WITH HIM, nearly no TV and VERY GOOD FOOD. Please!
By the way- I had to reduce my working-times, now earning less money. But what means money to me when I can help my son?
My son is the sunshine of my life. Such a thankful and loving boy. Every day he embraces me and gently says these words: Mama, ich liebe dich für immer und ewig! (Means: Mom, I will love you forever and always)!
I would prefer giving my life away before leaving Silas in such a home.
This is what I can say, but I am far away- not in America- not an Indian.
Best wishes and good luck!

Silvia

03-22-2006, 03:46 PM	#1 (permalink)
debbieyd Senior Dancer Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: ON THE REZ Posts: 595	Plea for Advice! I wrote about my grandson before and said he might be ADD or ADHD or something but anyway, I told my daughter that she should seek counseling, which she did, and now they are suggesting that she put her 4 year old son in a "Theraputic Foster Home" for some odd years!!! I thought these so called Family Counseling helped instead of passing the buck to another remedy! I'm so shocked about this event, and am very concerned about my grandson's impulsiveness, energy, and "no fear" attitude, any one got any advice for me? I'm afraid to put my grandson into a non Indian TFH and have him cry and throw fits about us neglecting him/abondoning him! __________________ [font=Garamond]RainbowDreamer

03-22-2006, 03:55 PM	#3 (permalink)
stomp Where's the next dance? Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: FL Posts: 97	Second opinion. Family counseling somewhere else, with native people who understand. This solution they recommend seems very severe. I don't blame you for being alarmed. Maybe intervention is needed, but why not with mom included, so she can learn the skills she needs to raise her child? Talk to everyone and anyone who will listen. This is all I have to say. I am no pro in this area, just want to let you know my thoughts and morning prayers will be with you. __________________ Dance together.

03-23-2006, 06:53 AM	#9 (permalink)
Blackbear Space Cowboy Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Alaska Posts: 9,618	Kids that DO have ADHD cannot be denied that they have it... it only took a day or two of my kid without her meds to convince my mother that there was something not right with her behaviors and that she was'nt just another version of myself when I was a kid. They can be a huge danger to themselves and when they say they dont know why they did something... they honestly do not know! I know that's hard to comprehend but if you think of dumb things you did when drunk or overexecited in your life and then go, now what the hell did I do that for?? That's kinda what they are going through ALL THE TIME. You know I hate to sound like an advocate for pharmaceutical companies, but the natural way on this one, (especially if he's as active as mine is like I'm betting he is) is a long slow process and some of us do not have the time, energy, patience and in some cases maturity to deal with it because it takes alot of commitment and research, especially with foods. But I just want to dispell a couple of misconceptions I know people have about adhd drugs because I had the same misconceptions myself. 1) They do not turn kids into zombie states. If they do, then your kid is not on the right drug or correct dosage.. go back to the doc and let him know. Your kid should be his own personality and energetic without all the bouncing off the walls and impulses. If your kid seems like its' in a normal state but you are'nt going batty or no longer have all the tension that you feel around them... it's working right. 2) They do not build up in the system, at least most don't. Just because they are amphetimenes.. it does not build up in your kid's system so that you have to slowly take them off the medicine, or lower the dosage to a safe level. Ridlin/Concerta, they do not even stay in their system 24/7 .. that's why there is the kind you give them twice a day, and the kind that is time released. This way if you want to make the choice of taking them off the drug for the summer when they are out of school you can do so, but as the doctors told me.. if it's not stunting their growth (which for some it can) and they are eating normally and sleeping good... then why put yourself through that. Remember, the drug does'nt just calm the kids down.. it helps them focus as well. Caffiene will do the same and that's why many of us feel more alert and focused after having a soda or coffee. However, caffiene is worse for them and is'nt time released, and is full of sugar. __________________ Don't worry that it's not good enough for anyone else to hear... just sing, sing a song.

03-22-2006, 04:05 PM	#4 (permalink)
kiowakat Banned Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: St.Louis Posts: 1,243	my opinion!!.... before you hand him over to "THE SYSTEM" foster homes....... is call around your area for self help groups that have the same problem, call hospitals and clinics every avenue you can, like dr. phil or oprah to see if there are such groups, the therapist is probably concerned that your not able to do it on your own and thats BS!!.... there are groups that will help and guide you and your family to stay together, with out DFS (divsion of family services) help. my 2 cents.

03-23-2006, 08:39 AM	#11 (permalink)
indian-heart-beat Banned Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Porta Westfalica Posts: 12,640	Hello, my 7 years old son Silas has this Attention Deficite Disease (Hyperactive). So have I- but like many of those adults- I'm more the 'dreamer'. Concentrating is sometimes very hard. Albert Einstein had ADD. Most of them are intelligent, helpful, creative and justice-loving children. In Germany there are about 500.000 Children with ADD (ADS-ADHS...Syndrom instead of disease). ADDs always feel attacked. They are loosing selfrespect and sometimes become aggressive because of that. It is hard (for them and their parents, teachers,...) Sometimes medicine like RETALIN can help to let their brain-metabolism work better. Bad education can make this disease worse, but it still IS a disease! Family, teachers, friends, neighbors, all can help these children feel a bit better and it will reflect to them. Only one example: When I am trying to tell my son Silas: Please do your homework, now...nothing will happen but stress. I have to touch him, look him in the eyes and when I've got the feeling he notices this, then he is able to listen and to 'understand' what I told him. Otherwise- no chance. (Playing soccer or basketball? No chance. But Kickbox-Jitsu helped very well. He is a very good tiny fighter!) So I don't need to give him any hormon-medicine. Not yet. I wish you the very best and Please- don't think your grandson is a bad child. Never. He only needs some more chances than others. Some loving parents spending A LOT OF TIME WITH HIM, nearly no TV and VERY GOOD FOOD. Please! By the way- I had to reduce my working-times, now earning less money. But what means money to me when I can help my son? My son is the sunshine of my life. Such a thankful and loving boy. Every day he embraces me and gently says these words: Mama, ich liebe dich für immer und ewig! (Means: Mom, I will love you forever and always)! I would prefer giving my life away before leaving Silas in such a home. This is what I can say, but I am far away- not in America- not an Indian. Best wishes and good luck! Silvia

03-23-2006, 09:16 AM	#12 (permalink)
Privateer6 Like my new toy? Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Cylon occupied North Carolina Posts: 775