moccasin sole construction

N8tiveLady78 · 05-16-2007, 12:46 AM

How do you get the hard latigo sole leather attached to the moccasin?

OLChemist · 05-16-2007, 11:12 AM

If they're plain's style hardsoles: After you massage the sole a bunch to make it easier to turn, run the handle of your scissors around the edge of the sole to kind of compress the leather. Tack the upper in place --making sure the whole thing is inside out -- at a few points. Then sew the upper to the sole, starting at the toe. You take the needle through the side of the sole and out through the upper making sort of a loop. When the mocc is turned, the stitches should "come out" the sides of the sole into the upper. You don't want to walk on your stitches. (Dang, I can't describe this well. It is too early, LOL. WyoRose, Blackbear, PB49 help!)

Converting a soft-sole to a hard sole (w/o removing the upper): Use barge cement or E6000 to glue the sole to the existing soft sole.

Fat Albert · 05-16-2007, 12:21 PM

Use a moccasin awl. Those make it easy. Stitch it together tight though so it holds up well. Basic whip stitch like OL Chemist described. Sew it inside out and stitch up the heel last after you have turned it right side out. Make sure you use close stitches and when you go through the latigo, you need to make sure you sew at an angle so the threads come out of the side of the latigo (so you don't walk on them). Some people swear by a welt between the upper and the latigo but I find it does not make much difference. Just depends on what kind of shoe you are making. Final suggestion, make sure your soles are right when you start to sew... sometimes the inside out thing is confusing when you get started and you don't want to get mixed up and put the wrong sole on or flip the hair side.

http://www.inquiry.net/images/rrm086.gif

Can't say I read any of this site's info but there is a small graphic showing at least one way to stitch. Good luck!

wyo_rose · 05-17-2007, 12:54 PM

I love latigo for soles. It's much easier to sew than rawhide, but you need to look for THINNER pieces, and already pliable if possible.

But then the thin, pliable soles are probably too thin to just sew the edge. Also with thicker latigo, make a stitch through the side and pull it very tight. If it comes out, you need to stitch through the entire thickness of sole.

As long as you use a good welt (thin strip of THICK buckskin) between your sole and the upper, you don't have to worry about walking on your stitches. Especially with latigo which is softer than rawhide.

An awl is essential for rawhide and some tough latigo. But usually for latigo I just use a size 12 sharp. The small needles just go through easier. Use a 10 sharp if you keep breaking needles.

And use the thickest thread you can fit through the hole. And make a knot every few stitches. That way if you get a blowout, it won't go that far.

Turning it right side out is sometimes difficult. Just start with the heel part and forge onward. It'll help you see how good of buckskin your upper is made of.

Blackbear · 05-17-2007, 03:38 PM

Can you guys wait just a few days? If so I have to make me a new pair of summer mocs and I like making the plains style hard soled because there are so many rocks in my yard and hard soled protects my tender feet better... I'll take pics and make a new tutorial even though I'm pretty sure Bum already did one... which I'll go try to find right now.

Blackbear · 05-17-2007, 03:42 PM

OK I found it and it's been added to tutorials for anyone interested. He did a great job with this tutorial and there are suggestions and pictures as well.

OLChemist · 05-17-2007, 04:35 PM

I find that rolling, flexing and massaging the latigo after you cut the sole, but before you sew on the upper makes turn the mocc easier. Really work it around to get it softened a bit. You can also leave the seam up the back of the heel unsewn until after you turn. Don't let the sound of your beadwork crunching scare you, that's normal.

05-16-2007, 12:46 AM	#1 (permalink)
N8tiveLady78 N8tiveLady78 Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 12	moccasin sole construction How do you get the hard latigo sole leather attached to the moccasin? __________________ [ COLOR=Red]~N8iveLady78~[/color]

05-17-2007, 12:54 PM	#4 (permalink)
wyo_rose Teenah's Too Cool Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Fort Washakie Posts: 8,019 Blog Entries: 2	I love latigo for soles. It's much easier to sew than rawhide, but you need to look for THINNER pieces, and already pliable if possible. But then the thin, pliable soles are probably too thin to just sew the edge. Also with thicker latigo, make a stitch through the side and pull it very tight. If it comes out, you need to stitch through the entire thickness of sole. As long as you use a good welt (thin strip of THICK buckskin) between your sole and the upper, you don't have to worry about walking on your stitches. Especially with latigo which is softer than rawhide. An awl is essential for rawhide and some tough latigo. But usually for latigo I just use a size 12 sharp. The small needles just go through easier. Use a 10 sharp if you keep breaking needles. And use the thickest thread you can fit through the hole. And make a knot every few stitches. That way if you get a blowout, it won't go that far. Turning it right side out is sometimes difficult. Just start with the heel part and forge onward. It'll help you see how good of buckskin your upper is made of. __________________ Don't take life so seriously! It's not permanent.

05-17-2007, 03:38 PM	#5 (permalink)
Blackbear Space Cowboy Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Alaska Posts: 9,618	Can you guys wait just a few days? If so I have to make me a new pair of summer mocs and I like making the plains style hard soled because there are so many rocks in my yard and hard soled protects my tender feet better... I'll take pics and make a new tutorial even though I'm pretty sure Bum already did one... which I'll go try to find right now. __________________ Don't worry that it's not good enough for anyone else to hear... just sing, sing a song.

05-17-2007, 03:42 PM	#6 (permalink)
Blackbear Space Cowboy Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Alaska Posts: 9,618	OK I found it and it's been added to tutorials for anyone interested. He did a great job with this tutorial and there are suggestions and pictures as well. __________________ Don't worry that it's not good enough for anyone else to hear... just sing, sing a song.

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05-16-2007, 11:12 AM	#2 (permalink)
OLChemist Pow Wow Committee Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 742	If they're plain's style hardsoles: After you massage the sole a bunch to make it easier to turn, run the handle of your scissors around the edge of the sole to kind of compress the leather. Tack the upper in place --making sure the whole thing is inside out -- at a few points. Then sew the upper to the sole, starting at the toe. You take the needle through the side of the sole and out through the upper making sort of a loop. When the mocc is turned, the stitches should "come out" the sides of the sole into the upper. You don't want to walk on your stitches. (Dang, I can't describe this well. It is too early, LOL. WyoRose, Blackbear, PB49 help!) Converting a soft-sole to a hard sole (w/o removing the upper): Use barge cement or E6000 to glue the sole to the existing soft sole.

05-16-2007, 12:21 PM	#3 (permalink)
Fat Albert Eater of all frybread!! Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Planet Earth Posts: 330	Use a moccasin awl. Those make it easy. Stitch it together tight though so it holds up well. Basic whip stitch like OL Chemist described. Sew it inside out and stitch up the heel last after you have turned it right side out. Make sure you use close stitches and when you go through the latigo, you need to make sure you sew at an angle so the threads come out of the side of the latigo (so you don't walk on them). Some people swear by a welt between the upper and the latigo but I find it does not make much difference. Just depends on what kind of shoe you are making. Final suggestion, make sure your soles are right when you start to sew... sometimes the inside out thing is confusing when you get started and you don't want to get mixed up and put the wrong sole on or flip the hair side. http://www.inquiry.net/images/rrm086.gif Can't say I read any of this site's info but there is a small graphic showing at least one way to stitch. Good luck!

05-17-2007, 04:35 PM	#7 (permalink)
OLChemist Pow Wow Committee Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 742	I find that rolling, flexing and massaging the latigo after you cut the sole, but before you sew on the upper makes turn the mocc easier. Really work it around to get it softened a bit. You can also leave the seam up the back of the heel unsewn until after you turn. Don't let the sound of your beadwork crunching scare you, that's normal.

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