Blackbear

Ok before I ask.. I want to say that I'm asking out of curiosity only, not making any judgements and totally understand and accept that this is Lakota way.

The questions are....

Why two dialects of the language, one for each gender?

Is there some passed down story of why the two speak different dialects?

Is the language still spoken in two dialects or is there one general one now that is taught to the young?

I appreciate anyone who can or would answer this for me. Thanks!!!!

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Don't worry that it's not good enough for anyone else to hear... just sing, sing a song.

Lakota Wiyan

There are 3 dialects, Lakota, Dakota and Nakota. What you are referring to is gender? Men and women speak the same "dialect", but use different terms for different kinship roles and a few other ways of expression. Its the same language, but as for a story, I dont think there is, not that I have ever heard of anyways. Here on the rez, there are language classes in each school, and the girls are taught the female way, and the boys are taught the male way. Its possible for one teach, of either gender to teach both, but some of the schools are hiring Female and Male Lakota language teachers.

Whats shocking to us here, is that alot of "sympathetic" people, who want so desperately to "BE LAKOTA", will learn the language and attempt to use it, with little regard to the proper USE of the language. Alot of women will come visit and speak as a man, and vice versa. Sadly, there is no getting through to them; they refuse to listen, so they continue on and basically make a mockery of our language. Its hard not to laugh at them, but we try!!

There are other differences, not only between the genders. Our kinship roles are so vast and complex, that sometimes, 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and so on, sons or daughters will all have different terms, and the same with cousins. Also, and older man, an elder, will use terms that a younger man wouldnt use (yet), and the same with young girls and grandmas. There are seven bands, Oceti Sakowin, and you will find small differences between all of us. Even on the reservations, there might differences between the tiyospayes, the families/communities.

The one constance among all the Lakota/Dakota/Nakota speakers is the overriding desire to see our language preserved. There have been a few generations where the language has been allowed to lapse, and fall from common use, but that is strongly being turned around. There is a new generation of speakers who are beginning to utilize the language more and more in their daily speak. Now, its not so unusual to find a very young child who is a fluent speaker, or a family that uses the language primarily in their homes. Its a slow turn around, but its finally happenening. Just attend one of our powwows and see how many young people know our songs. Its a really good thing.

Iowa_Boy

There are 5 dialects. The first two both call their language and themselves "Dakota".

They are (1) the Santee, Sisseton, Mdewakantonwan, and Wahpeton peoples in Minnesota and elsewhere.

The second (2) are the Yankton and Yanktonai people. These two dialects both employ the "D" but differ in consonant clusters, such as kd or kn.

The third (3) is Lakota, spoken by the Lakota people in SD and SK.

The fourth is (4) Assiniboine or "Nakota" spoken in two forms by the Assiniboine of MT and SK. The two forms are most easily distinguished by their use of either tk or kt.

The fifth is (5) Stoney or "Nakoda" in Alberta. The most divergent of the dialects and heavily Cree influenced. Most different in its placement of the stress on the second to last syllable.

What you are asking about is not dialect, but gender forms. Men and women have different "words", primarily sentence ending words called enclitics that mark the sentence as a request, question, etc.

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ballin_n_shawlin

wow that's interesting!! i always thought there were 3! D/N/L speakers!



hey lakota winyan.. i'm gonna catch you and pick ur brain one of these days! :P

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Lakota Wiyan

There are alot of variations of the SIOUAN language, but there are only three that are closely related, and that is the Lakota/Dakota/Nakota, which are used in the North/South Dakota, and Minnesota/Nebraska tribes of the Oceti Sakowin. They are similar enough to allow for understanding between all the relatives. But what do I know..Im just an Oglala Chick...hahahahah

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Ipsica Waci
Wicahpi Eyoyambya Olowan

Iowa_Boy

There are 5 that are closely related. "Siouan" as in the Siouan language family consists of many languages including Mandan, hidatsa, crow, winnebago, oto, Ponca-Omaha, Osage, Missouri, Iowa, Kansa, etc.

That language family has many branches. The Dakotan branch has five in it: Santee-Sisseton Dakota, Yankton-Yanktonai Dakota, Lakota, Assiniboine, and Stoney.

Most people in SD insist on this whole D-N-L thing, because there is confusion over Yankton-Yanktonai. They are not "N" speakers, ask any fluent Yankton who they are, and they will respond with "Dakota". It comes about because in some sub-dialects of Y-Y they use -na as the diminutive, so in Lakota "little cat" is igmula, but in Y-Y it is igmunda or igmuna, depending on the subdialect.

"N" in word initial position is only found in the real n dialects, Assiniboine and Stoney, but they are different from each other as well.

The two Dakota dialects and Lakota have enough in common that a fluent speaker can recognize what's going on, mostly differences in consonant clusters, but Assiniboine and Stoney, while related are the most different because they separated from others further back in time.

HEre's some examples:

Santee-Sisseton hdepa
Yankton-Yanktonai kdepa
Lakota glepa
Assiniboine knepa
Stoney hneba

same word 'to vomit' but you can see that there are subtle differences between them

the "ki" or "kin" in Lakota 'the' becomes "je" in Assiniboine and to make it worse the "le" 'this" also become "je"
-so Lakota "Le Anpetu kin" 'this day becomes je ampetu je in Assiniboine

but hey....

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Iowa_Boy

Here's a Siouan language chart for those interested.

Attached Images

Siouan language graph2.jpg (46.3 KB, 10 views)

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Lakota Wiyan

I guess I'll pass on your knowledge to Oglala Lakota College and the reservation schools and tell them they are teaching us all wrong......lmao

Thanks for the set down!! Keeps us humble, I guess.

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Ipsica Waci
Wicahpi Eyoyambya Olowan

Iowa_Boy

they know it. I taught Lakota in SD at a tribal college in the 90s, its easier to avoid delicate issues, esp with the political associations with the dnl idea.

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ballin_n_shawlin

well as long as everybody understands that LAKOTA is the first language... n the rest are just sub-divisions of lakota.. cuz we were here first...

ha ha ha... JUST KIDDING that could spark an argument! :P

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Mato Winyan

I guess I just don't "get it". According to your chart the Osage, Ponca, Otoe etc are Siouan languages. Wouldn't that mean that they would be somewhat similiar?

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"We see it as a desecration not only of a mountain but of our way of life. This is a genocidal issue to us. If they kill this mountain, they kill our way of life." ~Debra White Plume

Iowa_Boy

yes, yes they are!

the #4 in some Siouan lang's:

crow shopa
hidatsa topa
mandan top
lakota topa
winnebago jop
omaha-ponca duba
kansa doba
osage topa
quapaw topa

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Iowa_Boy

to take a step backward, I should note that there are 7 language families found on the great plains:

1) algonquian
-including cheyenne, blackfoot, arapaho, gros ventre, plains cree,

2) soiuan
-including stoney, assiniboine, hidatsa, mandan, crow Yankton-Yanktonai, Santee-Sisseton, Lakota, Ponca-Omaha, Iowa, oto, Missouria, Kansa, Osage Quapaw

3) Athapaskan
including Plains Apache, Lipan Apache

4) Caddoan
including Pawnee, Arikara, Caddo, Wichita, Kitsai

5) Kiowa-Tanoan
including Kiowa

6) Uto-Aztecan
including Comanche

7) Tonkawa
a language isolate (no other languages related to this one)

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