The New World, My Review

veritasxl · 01-18-2006, 03:55 AM

Just came home from the movie. Again, I am glad it was free to the first 300 or so here in the Ndn community here in Lala land.

Q'orinka looked the part and did a pretty good job. But the movie was so BORING.......

It's over 2 hours, and has less to do with the New World as a running narrative by Pocahontas and Smith declaring their love for each other. Not talking to each other, you just hear their voice as they stare and stare and stare at each other.

The music was awful and distracting, a lot of never ending arpeggios. Rolfe comes off as a saint, who doesn't mind his wife spending an afternoon with Smith to see if she still loves him. Yeah right.

Pocahontas runs around with half her a... showing...then in the snow her thighs are exposed. It's more of the directors imagination in over drive of what he thinks their romance may have been, very little historical content, Smith has one expression through the movie, staring at Pocahontas.

She gives the dying men corn to survive, they revive and kill her people. Wes Studi's character tried to get the chief to 'kill them while they are few' but he ignores that. The commander and Smith describe the Powhatan as happy carefee, childlike beings with no sense of ownership. yada yada yada.... Until of course they decide to stay.

The film is dark and gloomy and they had the nerve to use a metal detector on us to check us to make sure we didn't have a cell phone that films before going in to see it. At the end they asked for feedback and comments, and no one said anything. There was a Powhatan family there and they also said nothing.

I'm no Siskel and Ebert, but this one is going to DVD real fast. The guy setting next to me was fighting falling asleep and so was I, at least we got free popcorn and sodas.

V

Homalosa · 01-18-2006, 08:22 AM

Ha! I betcha the movie people didn't even interpret what it means when Indins don't have $hit to say! You're right, mommy, at least you got free popcorn and soda. PM me or email me at work to tell me who all was there! Did my brother make it?

Love you and thanks for the comedy!

WhoMe · 01-18-2006, 11:41 AM

Veritasxl,

Thanks for sharing your review. I saw the "Making of the New World" on HBO. The quotes, sound bites and film clips looked exciting. I'm sorry to hear the actual film was not.

How did the dancing and language come off? Was it believable?

I am going to see it when it opens here on Friday.

I am caught in the Indian syndrome of "There are so few Indian related films out there that I have to go check it out just out of curiousity!" *L

wyo_rose · 01-18-2006, 12:20 PM

I saw that too, WhoMe. It looked pretty good. And they talked about using no lighting, so that explains the dark and gloomy look, I'm sure.

You know, if you go in not expecting much, you might be pleasantly surprised.

veritasxl · 01-19-2006, 02:11 PM

I was told they had someone who actually speaks Algonquin, so I guess it was ligit. The one Powhatan family that was there didn't complain about that.Like you WHOME, I support films with Indians in them just because it gave them work. There wasn't much dancing in it, again, I am not that familiar with Eastern traditions and had hope to learn.

There were a lot of scenes that took place in the 'long house' which was interesting. They did show a lot of scenes with the men practicing their Bow skills and hand to hand combat. But there were other ironies, like them going out to battle and Pocahontas being the only female.

The music was sooo distracting, the first time it was okay with the ships landing and all, but to hear that same Beethovenesque riff over and over in an indian film was distracting. Thanks for the explination of why it was so dark. I guess I expected a lot more given Malick's rep and all.

Oh Homalosa, TJ was there, I rode with him, my first ride in the Powmobile (whew), everyone asked about you and misses you here in cali.

V

veritasxl · 01-19-2006, 02:18 PM

Oh I forgot to tell you Malik has her laying in dirt and sleeping in mud after Smith leaves, she so into grief. I can't imagine any Indian woman doing that, then or now, we usually just hold it in. But Malik has her so crazy in love with him, she dogs herself out. It almost like a Ndn chick flick. The men in the room weren't really into all the love narratives (at least the Indian men did seem to be). But go see it, by no means am I saying don't see it, but it is a love story.

Smith just doesn't seem to return the level of commitment and sacrifce
Pocahontas had for him. Please let me know what yall think after you see it. Maybe I am way off base and you'll love it.

V

luv2jingle · 01-20-2006, 07:06 PM

I haven't actually seen the movie yet but here is what some have to say....

Members of Virginia Indian Tribes React to the Inaccurate Portrayal of Their Heritage in the New Line Cinema Film "The New World", Which Opens Nationally on January 20

RICHMOND, Va., Jan. 16 /PRNewswire/ -- The film is a Hollywood rehashing

of the Pocahontas myth, this time without Disney animation. That myth hasbeen debunked by modern historians, who say that John Smith's account ofPowhatan's daughter throwing herself across his body just as he was about tobe killed could not have happened. "This film isn't history," notes Karenne Wood (Monacan), Chair of theVirginia Council on Indians and a PhD candidate in anthropology at theUniversity of Virginia. "It's harmful, because it portrays our peopleaccording to stereotypes about American Indians that we've worked for years todispel. Our women appear as either princesses or squaws, and our men areeither noble or warlike!
.
The New World is old hat, to us. It's the samestory, this time with Native actors and consultants. But it's still wrong." Particularly offensive to Virginia Indian women is the characterization ofPocahontas as the object of Smith's physical desire, even though she was only11 or 12 when they met, and Smith was closer to 30. The role is played by a14-year-old actress. "As the mother of a teenage daughter, I was veryuncomfortable with the romantic story line between Ms. Kilcher and Mr.Farrell," says Reeva Tilley (Rappahannock), Tribal Councilwoman. "Mr. Malickhad the opportunity to make an epic film about the merging of two dynamiccultures and their contributions and survival in the New World, yet the mainfocus remained the mythical love affair between Pocahontas and Captain JohnSmith. This film does not portray the true traditional values that I want!
conveyed to the world about the Virginia Indian people."

Virginia Indian leaders are frustrated, too, by the film's release topromote the 400th anniversary of Jamestown. The Tribes in Virginia have neverreceived the federal status enjoyed by some 567 other Indian tribes. Six ofthe Virginia Tribes want recognition to represent their culture at theJamestown Anniversary. Chief Anne Richardson of the Rappahannock Tribe spokebriefly on the recognition issue. "I feel it will be an internationalembarrassment if Virginia celebrates the 400th anniversary of theestablishment of the first permanent English settlement in America, and ourgovernment fails to recognize the Virginia Indian tribes that made itpossible. The United Kingdom honors us as sovereign nations, but our owncountry does not. I think it speaks volumes about how our government reallyfeels about us. Someone please inform the Congress that the war is over! Howmany generations will have to pass away before we can be honored in our ownland?"

Homalosa · 01-20-2006, 07:43 PM

And what gets me is how so many of these "reputable" critics, such as Ebert & Ropert falling for this bullzhit story. They claim the story is as romantic as Titanic and this guy here on Dallas' ABC channel said "it's authenticity hasn't been matched in years". WTF????? Was he being tongue in cheek, saying that it hasn't been matched because no one has ever told the dayum truth????

Blackbear · 01-20-2006, 10:17 PM

Blair Rudes was the language expert for that film and knows his stuff. He's the same guy who created a written language for the tuscaroras.

Smokin' Ace · 01-20-2006, 10:38 PM

Well -- I am very excited over the showing of the movie. May not see it this weekend, but will be sure to see it soon. I was a consultant on this movie and sent many people there to work. Alot of people were not able to go and were quite upset that they missed the opportunity.

I know that the people that worked on this movie worked very hard for authenticity.

Not everyone is always pleased - but I do know.. for a fact... that many efforts were made to make these scenes authentic.

As far as it turning to a love story.... it is still Hollywood that takes "real life" and asks.... what if??? There is no way that any major motion picture can give a play by play, day in day out production without, in some way, speculating how some of these historic figures "felt". "Feelings" weren't recorded very well...

I am thankful - as a person involved in the Entertainment business, that pictures are still being made with Native American themes and focuses. At least it is giving us something to think about - to be noticed - to get pissed off - and let the world know - we are still here.... it all works. I am working on a documentary now - and the footage is incredible - and because it IS a documentary - it is totally based on history - there is no speculation from the director/producers standpoint about how people felt - or what they thought - their ancestors and relatives are speaking for them... look for it in the Spring.

Have a great night...

veritasxl · 01-21-2006, 01:40 PM

Homalos, did you email that guy in Dallas? Maybe you could and enclose this thread, so he knows how the film is coming across to Indian community. Hopefully more will comment on their reaction as they see the film.

You're so right Luv2Jingle about the age difference, but they did the same thing to young african slave girls also. That's why, a lot of light skinned blacks came form Mississipi, Virgina and other slave states.

V

alamosaurus · 01-22-2006, 02:44 AM

The music used for the theme was actually by Wagner, not
Beethoven--it was the prelude to Das Rheingold, the
first opera in the Ring of the Niebelungs cycle. Wagner
may have been a great composer, but I think the use of
his music was inappropriate for this type of movie. Also,
one critic called him one of the world's most unpleasant
people--he was a wife stealer and a racist to boot. Hitler
got a lot of his ideas from Wagner's (non-musical)
writings.

SkyEagle · 01-22-2006, 01:04 PM

I had waited a long time to see this movie and was so disapointed with it. I would call it dark also.. ( not the lighting ).

What I did like with the beautiful country that it was produce in. The land was increadiable. It made you a part of the movie.

The camp of the whites seem to be what I would expect. Dirty water filled and not a good place to live.

I enjoyed how the Natives were pretrayed as living with each other and nature with out the ways of greed and hate. And that they lived with the land not off the land.

And what I found most interesting was how much differnt the two worlds were so much differnt. When she went back to england and saw the churches and gardens and the citys and homes. For some reason I had never pictured such a differnce.

What I hated was how the movie jumped all over the story. While you follow somewhat, It was hard and not very interesting. I would perfer more interaction and less sub titles and narration.

I would say that it is a movie to be seen, But not a very good one. You may learn a thing or two.. But not sure if its worth the money to see. May have to wait for the dvd to come out.

01-18-2006, 03:55 AM	#1 (permalink)
veritasxl Chahta Apokni Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Burque Posts: 243	The New World, My Review Just came home from the movie. Again, I am glad it was free to the first 300 or so here in the Ndn community here in Lala land. Q'orinka looked the part and did a pretty good job. But the movie was so BORING....... It's over 2 hours, and has less to do with the New World as a running narrative by Pocahontas and Smith declaring their love for each other. Not talking to each other, you just hear their voice as they stare and stare and stare at each other. The music was awful and distracting, a lot of never ending arpeggios. Rolfe comes off as a saint, who doesn't mind his wife spending an afternoon with Smith to see if she still loves him. Yeah right. Pocahontas runs around with half her a... showing...then in the snow her thighs are exposed. It's more of the directors imagination in over drive of what he thinks their romance may have been, very little historical content, Smith has one expression through the movie, staring at Pocahontas. She gives the dying men corn to survive, they revive and kill her people. Wes Studi's character tried to get the chief to 'kill them while they are few' but he ignores that. The commander and Smith describe the Powhatan as happy carefee, childlike beings with no sense of ownership. yada yada yada.... Until of course they decide to stay. The film is dark and gloomy and they had the nerve to use a metal detector on us to check us to make sure we didn't have a cell phone that films before going in to see it. At the end they asked for feedback and comments, and no one said anything. There was a Powhatan family there and they also said nothing. I'm no Siskel and Ebert, but this one is going to DVD real fast. The guy setting next to me was fighting falling asleep and so was I, at least we got free popcorn and sodas. V __________________ Civilzation has been thrust upon me..and it has not added one whit to my love for truth, honesty, and generosity Chief Luther Standing Bear

01-18-2006, 08:22 AM	#2 (permalink)
Homalosa Choc-lack-chick! Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Dallas, Texas (where da powwows at?) Posts: 1,586	Ha! I betcha the movie people didn't even interpret what it means when Indins don't have $hit to say! You're right, mommy, at least you got free popcorn and soda. PM me or email me at work to tell me who all was there! Did my brother make it? Love you and thanks for the comedy! __________________ Honor and respect your elders! "Until the lion learns to speak the tales of hunting will always favor the hunter." -K'Naan O-BAM-UH!!!! www.myspace.com/thobackmuzik www.myspace.com/asanicharles

01-18-2006, 11:41 AM	#3 (permalink)
WhoMe PauWau Coordinator Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Land of 370 Broken Treaties Posts: 5,555	Veritasxl, Thanks for sharing your review. I saw the "Making of the New World" on HBO. The quotes, sound bites and film clips looked exciting. I'm sorry to hear the actual film was not. How did the dancing and language come off? Was it believable? I am going to see it when it opens here on Friday. I am caught in the Indian syndrome of "There are so few Indian related films out there that I have to go check it out just out of curiousity!" *L __________________ "Today, recognizing and respecting the origins of powwow aids in our Cultural Survival. If enough people break the rules because they are not satisfied...."We will have no culture." WhoMe

01-18-2006, 12:20 PM	#4 (permalink)
wyo_rose Teenah's Too Cool Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Fort Washakie Posts: 8,015 Blog Entries: 2	I saw that too, WhoMe. It looked pretty good. And they talked about using no lighting, so that explains the dark and gloomy look, I'm sure. You know, if you go in not expecting much, you might be pleasantly surprised. __________________ Don't take life so seriously! It's not permanent.

01-19-2006, 02:11 PM	#5 (permalink)
veritasxl Chahta Apokni Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Burque Posts: 243	I was told they had someone who actually speaks Algonquin, so I guess it was ligit. The one Powhatan family that was there didn't complain about that.Like you WHOME, I support films with Indians in them just because it gave them work. There wasn't much dancing in it, again, I am not that familiar with Eastern traditions and had hope to learn. There were a lot of scenes that took place in the 'long house' which was interesting. They did show a lot of scenes with the men practicing their Bow skills and hand to hand combat. But there were other ironies, like them going out to battle and Pocahontas being the only female. The music was sooo distracting, the first time it was okay with the ships landing and all, but to hear that same Beethovenesque riff over and over in an indian film was distracting. Thanks for the explination of why it was so dark. I guess I expected a lot more given Malick's rep and all. Oh Homalosa, TJ was there, I rode with him, my first ride in the Powmobile (whew), everyone asked about you and misses you here in cali. V __________________ Civilzation has been thrust upon me..and it has not added one whit to my love for truth, honesty, and generosity Chief Luther Standing Bear

01-19-2006, 02:18 PM	#6 (permalink)
veritasxl Chahta Apokni Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Burque Posts: 243	Oh I forgot to tell you Malik has her laying in dirt and sleeping in mud after Smith leaves, she so into grief. I can't imagine any Indian woman doing that, then or now, we usually just hold it in. But Malik has her so crazy in love with him, she dogs herself out. It almost like a Ndn chick flick. The men in the room weren't really into all the love narratives (at least the Indian men did seem to be). But go see it, by no means am I saying don't see it, but it is a love story. Smith just doesn't seem to return the level of commitment and sacrifce Pocahontas had for him. Please let me know what yall think after you see it. Maybe I am way off base and you'll love it. V __________________ Civilzation has been thrust upon me..and it has not added one whit to my love for truth, honesty, and generosity Chief Luther Standing Bear

01-20-2006, 07:06 PM	#7 (permalink)
luv2jingle Pow Wow Visitor Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: durham Posts: 17	Just an FYI... I haven't actually seen the movie yet but here is what some have to say.... Members of Virginia Indian Tribes React to the Inaccurate Portrayal of Their Heritage in the New Line Cinema Film "The New World", Which Opens Nationally on January 20 RICHMOND, Va., Jan. 16 /PRNewswire/ -- The film is a Hollywood rehashing of the Pocahontas myth, this time without Disney animation. That myth hasbeen debunked by modern historians, who say that John Smith's account ofPowhatan's daughter throwing herself across his body just as he was about tobe killed could not have happened. "This film isn't history," notes Karenne Wood (Monacan), Chair of theVirginia Council on Indians and a PhD candidate in anthropology at theUniversity of Virginia. "It's harmful, because it portrays our peopleaccording to stereotypes about American Indians that we've worked for years todispel. Our women appear as either princesses or squaws, and our men areeither noble or warlike! . The New World is old hat, to us. It's the samestory, this time with Native actors and consultants. But it's still wrong." Particularly offensive to Virginia Indian women is the characterization ofPocahontas as the object of Smith's physical desire, even though she was only11 or 12 when they met, and Smith was closer to 30. The role is played by a14-year-old actress. "As the mother of a teenage daughter, I was veryuncomfortable with the romantic story line between Ms. Kilcher and Mr.Farrell," says Reeva Tilley (Rappahannock), Tribal Councilwoman. "Mr. Malickhad the opportunity to make an epic film about the merging of two dynamiccultures and their contributions and survival in the New World, yet the mainfocus remained the mythical love affair between Pocahontas and Captain JohnSmith. This film does not portray the true traditional values that I want! conveyed to the world about the Virginia Indian people." Virginia Indian leaders are frustrated, too, by the film's release topromote the 400th anniversary of Jamestown. The Tribes in Virginia have neverreceived the federal status enjoyed by some 567 other Indian tribes. Six ofthe Virginia Tribes want recognition to represent their culture at theJamestown Anniversary. Chief Anne Richardson of the Rappahannock Tribe spokebriefly on the recognition issue. "I feel it will be an internationalembarrassment if Virginia celebrates the 400th anniversary of theestablishment of the first permanent English settlement in America, and ourgovernment fails to recognize the Virginia Indian tribes that made itpossible. The United Kingdom honors us as sovereign nations, but our owncountry does not. I think it speaks volumes about how our government reallyfeels about us. Someone please inform the Congress that the war is over! Howmany generations will have to pass away before we can be honored in our ownland?" __________________ Behind every good man is an even better woman!

01-20-2006, 07:43 PM	#8 (permalink)
Homalosa Choc-lack-chick! Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Dallas, Texas (where da powwows at?) Posts: 1,586	And what gets me is how so many of these "reputable" critics, such as Ebert & Ropert falling for this bullzhit story. They claim the story is as romantic as Titanic and this guy here on Dallas' ABC channel said "it's authenticity hasn't been matched in years". WTF????? Was he being tongue in cheek, saying that it hasn't been matched because no one has ever told the dayum truth???? __________________ Honor and respect your elders! "Until the lion learns to speak the tales of hunting will always favor the hunter." -K'Naan O-BAM-UH!!!! www.myspace.com/thobackmuzik www.myspace.com/asanicharles

01-20-2006, 10:17 PM	#9 (permalink)
Blackbear Space Cowboy Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Alaska Posts: 9,618	Blair Rudes was the language expert for that film and knows his stuff. He's the same guy who created a written language for the tuscaroras. __________________ Don't worry that it's not good enough for anyone else to hear... just sing, sing a song.

01-20-2006, 10:38 PM	#10 (permalink)
Smokin' Ace Arena Director Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: United States Posts: 4,110	Well -- I am very excited over the showing of the movie. May not see it this weekend, but will be sure to see it soon. I was a consultant on this movie and sent many people there to work. Alot of people were not able to go and were quite upset that they missed the opportunity. I know that the people that worked on this movie worked very hard for authenticity. Not everyone is always pleased - but I do know.. for a fact... that many efforts were made to make these scenes authentic. As far as it turning to a love story.... it is still Hollywood that takes "real life" and asks.... what if??? There is no way that any major motion picture can give a play by play, day in day out production without, in some way, speculating how some of these historic figures "felt". "Feelings" weren't recorded very well... I am thankful - as a person involved in the Entertainment business, that pictures are still being made with Native American themes and focuses. At least it is giving us something to think about - to be noticed - to get pissed off - and let the world know - we are still here.... it all works. I am working on a documentary now - and the footage is incredible - and because it IS a documentary - it is totally based on history - there is no speculation from the director/producers standpoint about how people felt - or what they thought - their ancestors and relatives are speaking for them... look for it in the Spring. Have a great night... __________________ Everything is gonna be alright! Be blessed - got love??? This b me..... www.myspace.com/akayo

01-21-2006, 01:40 PM	#11 (permalink)
veritasxl Chahta Apokni Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Burque Posts: 243	Homalos, did you email that guy in Dallas? Maybe you could and enclose this thread, so he knows how the film is coming across to Indian community. Hopefully more will comment on their reaction as they see the film. You're so right Luv2Jingle about the age difference, but they did the same thing to young african slave girls also. That's why, a lot of light skinned blacks came form Mississipi, Virgina and other slave states. V __________________ Civilzation has been thrust upon me..and it has not added one whit to my love for truth, honesty, and generosity Chief Luther Standing Bear

01-22-2006, 02:44 AM	#12 (permalink)
alamosaurus Teen Dancer Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Greater Los Angeles. Posts: 266	The music used for the theme was actually by Wagner, not Beethoven--it was the prelude to Das Rheingold, the first opera in the Ring of the Niebelungs cycle. Wagner may have been a great composer, but I think the use of his music was inappropriate for this type of movie. Also, one critic called him one of the world's most unpleasant people--he was a wife stealer and a racist to boot. Hitler got a lot of his ideas from Wagner's (non-musical) writings. __________________ alamosaurus

01-22-2006, 01:04 PM	#13 (permalink)
SkyEagle Tiny Tot Dancer Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Georgia Posts: 34	I had waited a long time to see this movie and was so disapointed with it. I would call it dark also.. ( not the lighting ). What I did like with the beautiful country that it was produce in. The land was increadiable. It made you a part of the movie. The camp of the whites seem to be what I would expect. Dirty water filled and not a good place to live. I enjoyed how the Natives were pretrayed as living with each other and nature with out the ways of greed and hate. And that they lived with the land not off the land. And what I found most interesting was how much differnt the two worlds were so much differnt. When she went back to england and saw the churches and gardens and the citys and homes. For some reason I had never pictured such a differnce. What I hated was how the movie jumped all over the story. While you follow somewhat, It was hard and not very interesting. I would perfer more interaction and less sub titles and narration. I would say that it is a movie to be seen, But not a very good one. You may learn a thing or two.. But not sure if its worth the money to see. May have to wait for the dvd to come out.