Women Drumers??How do you feel??

Tibiki Kinew · 08-19-2003, 12:12 PM

I know that this subject should get a response,how do you feel Ladies?? You were once the keepers of the drum...should you stand under the arbour or not..I say YES and sing loud and clear while you are at it!!!

Chi Meegwetch to all you Ladies out there!!!!!!!!

ojibway_jingle · 09-05-2003, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Tibiki Kinew
I know that this subject should get a response,how do you feel Ladies?? You were once the keepers of the drum...should you stand under the arbour or not..I say YES and sing loud and clear while you are at it!!!

Chi Meegwetch to all you Ladies out there!!!!!!!!

I agree with you Kinew 100%.
I know many say "times have changed". And that is very true, however, I am one that does not want our traditions to change. Anishnabe way of life has been given to us by K'che Maniido, the original instructions for us 'shnabe people. Why give away what was PERSONALLY given to us? Not this ikwe.

Traditionally, woodland 'shnabe ikwes do not sit at the drum and actually drum and sing. (Gawd my nokomis would have heart attack). When we stand behind the men and sing in that beautiful suprano voices of ours it is the most loveliest sound ever! :o :o :o :o

Tibiki Kinew · 09-08-2003, 06:41 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ojibway_jingle
I agree with you Kinew 100%.
I know many say "times have changed". And that is very true, however, I am one that does not want our traditions to change. Anishnabe way of life has been given to us by K'che Maniido, the original instructions for us 'shnabe people. Why give away what was PERSONALLY given to us? Not this ikwe.

Traditionally, woodland 'shnabe ikwes do not sit at the drum and actually drum and sing. (Gawd my nokomis would have heart attack). When we stand behind the men and sing in that beautiful suprano voices of ours it is the most loveliest sound ever! :o :o :o :o

Kokomis actually told me to sit and listen while the ladies got up and drummed and sang. They may not be accepted by a lot of males but they do get my vote. It makes me proud to have them come to practice once a week in my home.

ojibway_jingle · 09-08-2003, 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Tibiki Kinew
Kokomis actually told me to sit and listen while the ladies got up and drummed and sang. They may not be accepted by a lot of males but they do get my vote. It makes me proud to have them come to practice once a week in my home.

Perhaps I misunderstood you then. LOL. My bad.
No women drummers here, just the canaries standing behind the men singing accompanying their male voices. :-)

Tibiki Kinew · 09-08-2003, 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ojibway_jingle
Perhaps I misunderstood you then. LOL. My bad.
No women drummers here, just the canaries standing behind the men singing accompanying their male voices. :-)

That is very SAD, remember the women were given the drum first, then they passed it on to the men. Women are still the keepers of the drum, no matter what men say they were only allowed to use it. Boy oh boy this is going to hit a sour note with a lot of male drummers but fess up guys, read your history... the women gave the drum to the men. So never exclude them from the drum. And yes a good healing song sure makes a person feel good. A woman in Maniwaki was told she could not play the drum or sing. She went and did the ultimate, the sundance and she has the markings on her breast from the skewers that held her to the leather thongs. She was so firm in her belief that she survived the guys! Then she sang her strong woman song with the drum to rounds of applause.

Top it off she is a grandmother, a true Kokomis an Elder of amazing strenght. She now does the water blessing ceremony and you should see her following!!
I sat in the circle with her at a healing and spiritual gathering, it left me feeling a lot different and my respect ahs not only grown for this amazing woman but it has grown with pride that we do have some very strong folks out there that are still willing to give their best.

**Jibby™** · 09-08-2003, 09:33 AM

Niijikwe,

If you don't already know, our friend Tibiki is about as chigoozhi as they get.

I am with Ojib all the way. Women behind the drum.

Tibiki Kinew · 09-08-2003, 09:36 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jibby™
Niijikwe,

If you don't already know, our friend Tibiki is about as chigoozhi as they get.

I am with Ojib all the way. Women behind the drum.

Hey Jibby I don't know what that means, but if you say crazy,, dam you are right and I am still proud to be here!!! Good morning to you from your side of the border!!!!!!!!!!

ojibway_jingle · 09-08-2003, 10:25 AM

"SAD"...hmmm....I don't refer to an old "Ojibway" tradition as sad. The Anishnaabe Ikwe gave the men a drum, yes that is very true. By original instruction that woman was told to pass it onto the men for them to sing their wardances, healing songs, etc etc. The "Ojibway" women stood in behind their men and sang accompanying their men giving them strength. The women were told to do the beadwork on the skirt of the drum and to make the tobacco pouches that hang from it and to make the blanket that wraps the drum and to keep it clean. These are the Ogitchida Ikwewak as my Nokoomis was, and was hers. We were taught that "ojibway teaching" from that far back and I was told in time it will be my responsibility next and perhaps my daughters' after me. There are many many Ojibway elders who know this teaching and those elders still live it.
I am not referring to other tribes' customs and ways. I know as well as many others there are tribes who allow women to sing and drum at the drum like the men. I am only saying this is on Ojibway teaching and we are a woodland tribe. Woodland tribes consist of Ojibway, potawatomi odaw menominee saulteaux swampy cree (and a few more)

Tibiki Kinew · 09-08-2003, 10:29 AM

Yes even the Anishinabe are a part of the woodland tribes, don't forget the Huron Wendat as well!!! Along with the Odawa. And we can't forget Jibby!!!!
As far as sad goes I meant that only as being sad that your women are excluded from the drumming itself.

ojibway_jingle · 09-08-2003, 10:40 AM

Thats my point! How can that be SAD when it is tradition from time immemorial? My fellow anishnabe women are not excluded from the drum. We are the keepers of it. We just follow our tradition and don't sit at it and sing like the men do. :-)

Tibiki Kinew · 09-08-2003, 10:46 AM

Where I am they heave their own drum as well as keeping the drum of the men in working order, like you say the skirt for the drum and so on. But here the women also sit by their very own drum and when they let loose it is a wonder to hear.

09-08-2003, 10:48 AM

how are we excluded if we are behind our men, is what I am wondering. Maybe I don't read the same books as Tibiki does, I only go by what is taught by my relatives.

08-19-2003, 12:12 PM	#1 (permalink)
Tibiki Kinew Listen to my heart! Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Pikwakanagan, Yes Golden Lake Ontario Posts: 688	Women Drumers??How do you feel?? I know that this subject should get a response,how do you feel Ladies?? You were once the keepers of the drum...should you stand under the arbour or not..I say YES and sing loud and clear while you are at it!!! Chi Meegwetch to all you Ladies out there!!!!!!!!

09-08-2003, 09:33 AM	#6 (permalink)
Jibby™ NDNBUNZ Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: BABYLON HATE MACHINE Posts: 2,094	Niijikwe, If you don't already know, our friend Tibiki is about as chigoozhi as they get. I am with Ojib all the way. Women behind the drum. __________________ Got percap?

09-08-2003, 10:29 AM	#9 (permalink)
Tibiki Kinew Listen to my heart! Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Pikwakanagan, Yes Golden Lake Ontario Posts: 688	Yes even the Anishinabe are a part of the woodland tribes, don't forget the Huron Wendat as well!!! Along with the Odawa. And we can't forget Jibby!!!! As far as sad goes I meant that only as being sad that your women are excluded from the drumming itself. __________________ Listen to my heart, not just my mouth! The most powerfull thing we can do is,,,share,,, if we don't it dies with us. The Children are our Future, without them we leave nothing behind but our silence... Listen to the wind,,, it has so many secrets.... especially never assume who I am, you may get a surprize you are not ready for! Remember being Heyoka doesn't mean I am crazy, just having fun!!! Born in Winnipeg raised in the Pikwakanagan, Deutschland was never home!

09-08-2003, 10:46 AM	#11 (permalink)
Tibiki Kinew Listen to my heart! Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Pikwakanagan, Yes Golden Lake Ontario Posts: 688	Where I am they heave their own drum as well as keeping the drum of the men in working order, like you say the skirt for the drum and so on. But here the women also sit by their very own drum and when they let loose it is a wonder to hear. __________________ Listen to my heart, not just my mouth! The most powerfull thing we can do is,,,share,,, if we don't it dies with us. The Children are our Future, without them we leave nothing behind but our silence... Listen to the wind,,, it has so many secrets.... especially never assume who I am, you may get a surprize you are not ready for! Remember being Heyoka doesn't mean I am crazy, just having fun!!! Born in Winnipeg raised in the Pikwakanagan, Deutschland was never home!

09-08-2003, 10:25 AM	#8 (permalink)
ojibway_jingle Tiny Tot Dancer Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 87	"SAD"...hmmm....I don't refer to an old "Ojibway" tradition as sad. The Anishnaabe Ikwe gave the men a drum, yes that is very true. By original instruction that woman was told to pass it onto the men for them to sing their wardances, healing songs, etc etc. The "Ojibway" women stood in behind their men and sang accompanying their men giving them strength. The women were told to do the beadwork on the skirt of the drum and to make the tobacco pouches that hang from it and to make the blanket that wraps the drum and to keep it clean. These are the Ogitchida Ikwewak as my Nokoomis was, and was hers. We were taught that "ojibway teaching" from that far back and I was told in time it will be my responsibility next and perhaps my daughters' after me. There are many many Ojibway elders who know this teaching and those elders still live it. I am not referring to other tribes' customs and ways. I know as well as many others there are tribes who allow women to sing and drum at the drum like the men. I am only saying this is on Ojibway teaching and we are a woodland tribe. Woodland tribes consist of Ojibway, potawatomi odaw menominee saulteaux swampy cree (and a few more)

09-08-2003, 10:40 AM	#10 (permalink)
ojibway_jingle Tiny Tot Dancer Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 87	Thats my point! How can that be SAD when it is tradition from time immemorial? My fellow anishnabe women are not excluded from the drum. We are the keepers of it. We just follow our tradition and don't sit at it and sing like the men do. :-)

09-08-2003, 10:48 AM	#12 (permalink)
Awful_Mnom_Woman Guest Posts: n/a	how are we excluded if we are behind our men, is what I am wondering. Maybe I don't read the same books as Tibiki does, I only go by what is taught by my relatives.

09-08-2003, 10:51 AM	#13 (permalink)
Jibby™ NDNBUNZ